Loading AI tools
From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
This article was nominated for deletion on 10 February 2011 (UTC). The result of the discussion was speedy keep. |
This article is rated C-class on Wikipedia's content assessment scale. It is of interest to the following WikiProjects: | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
|
I'm translating this article to German to blue some redlinks, but when I came to last paragraph in "linguistic features" I was just perplexed. All this make like no sense to me and doesn't seem to be very English. Can somebody do something about that? --Kazu89 ノート 16:03, 22 March 2009 (UTC)
Need to the help, primarily for the sake of the complex linguistic concepts. Furthermore i pray the administrators for the move: the Prekmurian dialect so be it Prekmurian language, considering have standard. Doncsecz 11:45, 23 March 2009 (UTC)
Ok. Doncsecz 14:51, 23 March 2009 (UTC)
I have to disagree with the proposal to move the article from Prekmurian dialect to Prekmurian language. The argument for the move is that it has a standard. This is only partially true. It would be more appropriate to say that it had a standard, since it fell into disuse after 1945 (and it had been decaying since 1919). Even if we pass over that, I don't think having a literary standard is enough to qualify a dialect as a language. Viator slovenicus (talk) 16:41, 23 March 2009 (UTC)
Could somebody please provide the original title of the Hymn Book of Martjanci? I think it'll help me with my translation. Thanks. --Kazu89 ノート 15:40, 24 March 2009 (UTC)
I can't tell. The ABC book of Miklós Küzmics here and there ABC Kni'zicza, or ABC knižica, alike the gospel Szvéti evangyeliomi, Sveti evangjeliomi. The Old prekmurian was use to the hungarian orthography. Doncsecz 16:54, 24 March 2009 (UTC)
I reprise: so be it the name of the article: Prekmurian language. Allude to the preceding sources (explorations of Vilko Novak and Ágoston Pável, the Küzmics Gospels, ABC-books, Grammars, at is were 300 year-long education), together with the article Burgenland Croatian language. This is as well a autonomous croatian dialect, have literary standard. Besides the burgenlandian was act upon to the prekmurian. Albeit other the present prekmurian, but it is here this text in old hungarian standard. Slightly other, but understandable. The present livonian language likewise yet differing, like the old livonian, inasmuch as the latvian impact, but the livonian was none latvian dialect. Doncsecz 08:14, 28 April 2009 (UTC)
Viator, you wrote this: Prekmurian is sometimes considered a regional language, although it does not possess the requirements to qualify as regional language according to the European Charter for Regional or Minority Languages, nor is it recognized as such either by the Slovenian state or by the vast majority of its speakers. It is however one of the few Slovene dialects on Slovenian soil which is still spoken in an almost integral way by all strata of the local population.
Reverse: the European Charter for Regional or Minority Languages is apply to the prekmurian: the prekmurian language have own territory and numerous speakers. The speakers partly therefore not define to so that language, as the Prekmurje is a high and dry region, the people mostly unlearnt. A number of persons be a stranger to the prekmurian holy gospels and books.
The two Küzmics, Klekl, Szakovics, Pável, and today Feri Lainšček and others pronounce to language.
In the communistic Yugoslavia was underrate the prekmurian, as his literature decisively is sacralian, and few writer Klek and Szakovics was hate to the comunism. Few socialistic and comunistic egg-head was worked againts the prekmurian press and impression of books, so also Miško Kranjec, where was not immaculate preson. Klekl was renew to the standard prekmurian language in the Novine and the new books, as know, why language the prekmurian. Doncseczznánje 11:27, 29 December 2009 (UTC)
Yes, the public use of the standard prekmurian was stop, but the standard language, which József Klekl devise, today alike usable, as in the Novine the words today as such in the Goričko dialect. As spoken language the prekmurian was not ceased, and not come down all the same, that the slovene standard language was to prepossess. Alsó Lainšček he could, that apply the standard language of Klekl and Szakovics, but it have no mastery, because not wrought the new standard prekmurian language, but the olda standard (see: Slovar stare knjižne prekmurščine). Doncseczznánje 17:48, 29 December 2009 (UTC)
I add to, that into the Prekmurje and in Hungary more and more speaking of the prekmurian, and non-prekmurian persons so ponder to, that the prekmurian alike second slovene language-norm, likewise the resian language in Italy. Not but to be tipify slovene language, yet the croatian language dispose foure language-norm (kajkavian, štokavian, Burgenland and čakavian languages). Doncsecztalk 11:02, 16 February 2010 (UTC)
English-language scholarship does not typically form the adjective "Prekmurian" (cf. http://kuscholarworks.ku.edu/dspace/bitstream/1808/5268/1/2Greenberg.pdf). I suggest moving this page to "Prekmurje Slovenian" (or "Prekmurje Slovene", it doesn't matter to me) to avoid the language/dialect debate. Doremo (talk) 11:48, 2 March 2010 (UTC)
My colleguae and administrator of the hungarian wikipedia is perfect in english, his reaction, that the name prekmurian language, prekmurian dialect suit to in the english, grammatically is acceptable. Besides: i am slovene, i and others slovenes claim the use, of the name prekmurian. Before long get to presentation the prekmurian to the SIL and with name prekmurian. Doncsecztalk 09:10, 3 March 2010 (UTC)
English forms adjectives from place names for regions in various ways. Some are made with -(ia)n (e.g., Bavaria > Bavarian), some with -(n)ese (e.g., Aceh > Acehnese), and some are idiosyncratic (e.g., Wales > Welsh), among other patterns. Very many are formed through conversion, or zero derivation (e.g., Vorarlberg > Vorarlberg; “the Vorarlberg economy”). Prekmurje is one of these last examples; quality English scholarship tends to use “Prekmurje” as the adjective form. Examples include Greenberg (one of the best-known English scholars working on Slovenian) (“Prekmurje grammar”, “Prekmurje Slovene grammar”, “Prekmurje dialect of Slovene” http://kuscholarworks.ku.edu/dspace/bitstream/1808/5268/1/2Greenberg.pdf), as well as research by Slovenian scholars – for example, Mihaela Koletnik (“the Prekmurje dialect” http://www.zrc-sazu.si/isjfr/jz6.htm), Tjaša Jakop (“Prekmurje dialects” http://bos.zrc-sazu.si/c/Dial/Ponovne_SLA/01_PDF_prispevki/Jakop_2006a.pdf), Matjaž Klemenčič (“the Prekmurje dialect”, “Prekmurje Slovenes” http://www2.arnes.si/~ljinv16/RIG/RIG%2055/Klemencic.pdf), and others. Good English scholarship (both native and nonnative)refers to the “Prekmurje dialect”. User Doncsecz has been unilaterally promoting the adjective form “Prekmurian”, often citing an abstract by Marko Jesenšek. However, other material by Jesenšek also contains the more typical form “Prekmurje” (“Prekmurje newspapers”, “Prekmurje dialect” http://www.centerslo.net/files/File/simpozij/sim22/Jesensek.pdf). (In general, it is difficult to rely on such material in any case, because it may reflect the effort of a nonnative translator rather than the author.) I conclude that there is no justifiable reason to use the form “Prekmurian” – not on the basis of English word-formation patterns, not on the basis of native English scholarship, and not on the basis of nonnative English scholarship. Doremo (talk) 05:55, 4 March 2010 (UTC)
Oh, yes, but Greenberg wrote first tractate in 1989. Thence was come in the also prekmurian idiom. Doremo, you was come one pat, when brew to the petition to the SIL. As yet was not problems at the prekmurian idiom, now you make negative procedure. Doncsecztalk 09:23, 6 March 2010 (UTC)
I don't care what abouth other languages, as this is prekmurian language, not german, not japan, not african. There is not yet official denomination and cut is short the persistent meticulosity, as this is my mother tongue, also i was design to this article and just is my claim! Doncsecztalk 16:04, 6 March 2010 (UTC)
The following WP principles (from http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:No_original_research#Neutral_point_of_view) may be helpful in resolving this discussion:
Doremo (talk) 05:24, 8 March 2010 (UTC)
Doncsecz, you are continuing to degrade this and other articles by changing good English to broken English (e.g., http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Prekmurian_dialect&diff=prev&oldid=348946058). Please join this conversation by 1) providing some quality English sources using "Prekmurian" (you have offered absolutely nothing so far) and 2) stating why "Prekmurian" is justified as either a majority or significant minority usage in literature on this topic. Doremo (talk) 07:36, 11 March 2010 (UTC)
Response to Third Opinion Request: |
Disclaimers: I am responding to a third opinion request made at WP:3O. I have made no previous edits on Prekmurje Slovene and have no known association with the editors involved in this discussion. The third opinion process (FAQ) is informal and I have no special powers or authority apart from being a fresh pair of eyes. Third opinions are not tiebreakers and should not be "counted" in determining whether or not consensus has been reached. My personal standards for issuing third opinions can be viewed here. |
Opinion: It appears to me that the weight of reliable sources favors Prekmurje and that is what ought to be used, but if the source relied upon by Doncsecz can be considered reliable then that form should at least be mentioned in the lede. Ultimately the question is what's best for Wikipedia, especially as the title of an article, and what's best is what an English-speaking ordinary Internet user would type into the search blank. That would be the most common usage, which is Prekmurje, not Prekmurian or Prekmurjian which would in most cases be a guess. |
What's next: Once you've considered this opinion click here to see what happens next.—TRANSPORTERMAN (TALK) 18:40, 6 March 2010 (UTC) |
Addendum re Third Opinion: I note that someone relisted this dispute at the Third Opinion Project. Another volunteer at the project (not me) removed the listing because I had already given a third opinion. While it is possible to relist a new dispute about an article, it is not possible to get another opinion on the same dispute. If the original third opinion does not settle the dispute, you need to move on to some other form of dispute resolution such as a request for comments (RfC), a posting at an appropriate Wikipedia project (perhaps WikiProject Languages), or taking it to the Mediation Cabal. An RfC request or project posting can often be the most helpful because it invites other editors into the discussion which will often help to reach consensus rather than just settle the matter between the two or three editors currently involved in the dispute. Be careful, however, not to get involved in improper canvassing, either directly or by forum shopping. — TRANSPORTERMAN (TALK) 19:58, 8 March 2010 (UTC)
Requesting comment on the appropriateness of Prekmurian/Prekmurje as a modifier. Doremo (talk) 04:25, 9 March 2010 (UTC)
Summary and comment. I have posted a neutral request for comment on this topic and look forward to other editors’ comments. The following comment is not neutral because it reflects my position. On 28 February 2010 (when my edit history on this topic begins) I appear to have wandered into an area important to user Doncsecz: Prekmurje and Prekmurje Slovenian. There is an established tradition of English-language scholarship on this topic (see “Suggested move” and “Prekmurje, not ‘Prekmurian’” above) and scholarly literature typically refers to “the Prekmurje dialect,” “Prekmurje Slovenes,” and so on (see linked references above). Many of the articles I have edited on this topic had been tagged for copy editing for quite a long time due to their very poor language quality. Unfortunately, it has been impossible to move forward on copy editing these articles due to reversion by Doncsecz (in addition to reverting “Prekmurje” to “Prekmurian” he has repeatedly and unhelpfully reverted other good copy-editing changes to broken English; e.g., http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Prekmurian_dialect&diff=prev&oldid=346878113). Because Doncsecz’s activity appears to be focused on “Prekmurian” (a word form that I can find in no well-edited scholarly literature on this topic, of which there is plenty), I request that any comments focus on this issue in particular. Doremo (talk) 07:23, 9 March 2010 (UTC)
Irrespectively of the Greenberg's tractates and others the SIL likely that adopt to the prekmurian name. Doncsecztalk 10:34, 11 March 2010 (UTC)
Here a new article in english from Marko Jesenšek The Slovene Language in the Alpine and Pannonian Language Area. The History of the Slovene Language], where apply the prekmurian language name. Doncsecztalk 11:29, 30 March 2010 (UTC)
Needless and blunt stretch: not formal the Prekmurje or Prekmurian name.
Hello. Please read:
Best regards, --R.Schuster (talk) 10:24, 11 June 2010 (UTC)
But this is not simply words, as the Lord's Prayer is coherent text. Doncsecztalk 14:58, 11 June 2010 (UTC)
Besides, you was defecate my image, for ex. the Grave of Vince Talabér. Doncsecztalk 15:01, 11 June 2010 (UTC)
The examples exemplify the language. Few articles of languages in wikipedia be full of similar examples. Doncsecztalk 09:24, 12 June 2010 (UTC)
Wends was a Slavic language: Prekmurian language. Vandalic was a Germanic language.--95.250.48.36 (talk) 17:52, 9 December 2010 (UTC)
My God! The article's theme not this, that the Prekmurian is the Vandalic language, but the old name of the Prekmurian language is the Vandalic (lingua vandalica, vandalski jezik). Doncsecztalk 17:55, 9 December 2010 (UTC)
What kind of this observation? The Wends language also alternative name of the Prekmurian, like the Pannon-Slovene, East-Slovene. The prekmurian for the present unrecognized language, make no codes, therefore the few names. Doncsecztalk 19:11, 9 December 2010 (UTC)
"Some consider Prekmurian a regional language, without denying that it is part of Slovene." - the word 'some' is vague and should be avoided (per WP:AVOID), a reference should be provided to support the statement. Academic sources (peer-reviewed articles) should be cited regarding Prekmurian as a language or the statement should be put into context. --Eleassar my talk 09:50, 27 December 2010 (UTC)
Kako bi lahko prevedli to izraz: pokrajinski jezik. Seveda regionalna jezika v Sloveniji sta madžarščina in italijanščina, dokler prekmurščina je pokrajinski jezik. Ker glej Duličenkov izraz mikrojeziki, ali osamosovjeno narečje. Ker pokrajinski jezik je drugačen kot regionalni jezik, ampak v angleščino ne moremo drugačno prevesti pokrajinski samo regional. In jaz sem citiral znanstvena dela, od Avgusta Pavla. Prav tako Jože Toporišič tudi piše, da prekmurščina in rezijanščina imata delno samostojnost znotraj slovenščine. Vilko Novak zelo veliko je pisal o prekmurski književnosti, da je do druge svetovne vojne ohranila značilnosti prekmurskega jezika. Danes še vedno najdemo največ značilnosti v prekmurščini. Povrh pa koliko ljudi je privrženo prekmurščini. Poglej sobota info, ali Branka Pintariča, ki je gledališki ustvarjalec in kako meni o prekmurščini. Zakaj pišejo Feri Lainšček, Milan Vincetič (ki je profesor slovenščine), Milan Zrinski, Miki Roš, Jože Ftičar in drugi v prekmurščini? Ker ima zelo bogato in staro tradicijo ter zgodovino. Ravno tako kajkavščina in čakavščina na Hrvaškem. V prekmurščini še vedno se izraziti veliko terminoloških izrazov tudi. Doncsecztalk 11:58, 27 December 2010 (UTC)
It is written, that Ágoston Pável (like erudite specialist) downright stress to the marked status of the Prekmurian in the Slovene. But Jože Toporišič slovene linguist also take note of the sensible separateness of the Resian and Prekmurian. Vilko Novak wrote about the Prekmurian literature, that up the World War II wa retain the idiosyncrasys of the prekmurian language. Today also visible still the utmost idiosyncrasy. The question regional language: in slovene language prekmurščina je pokrajinski jezik. Yes in Slovenia the regional-minority languages (regionalski-manjšinski jezik) by the European Charter for Regional or Minority Languages the Hungarian and Italian language, but the Prekmurian is pokrajinski jezik (pokrajinski in English also regional). Doncsecztalk 12:19, 27 December 2010 (UTC)
Marko Jesenšek the rector of the Univerisity Maribor not deplore the Prekmurian terminology and the standards of the English language also permit of the -ian terminal by the name Prekmurje, while in another names Gorenjsko, Dolenjsko this beyond possibility. Doncsecztalk 16:55, 9 February 2011 (UTC)
All the same is not impossible and considered the use of this term. In the Slovene wikipedia i wrote article about the Arberesh language and frame the term Arberščina, as in the Slovene terminology for the present want this word. Doncsecztalk 17:00, 9 February 2011 (UTC)
In another countrys of Slovenia consider the Prekmurian some a dialect, in the Prekmurje consider the Slovene language of Prekmurje. Between the World Wars few Slovene linguists and Civilians considered the Prekmurian a language in the Communistic Yugoslavia railroad this persons, those who support the Prekmurian. In the title the "Prekmurian dialect" denote, that this is Slovene dialect, but separate dialect Eleassar! In the Zora books emerge the notable separateness of the Prekmurian. Doncsecztalk 17:09, 9 February 2011 (UTC)
Tukaj zakaj pišejo Buda Castle, ni treba bolj Budai Vár tudi v angleščini? Pred devetdesetemi leti niso uporabili angleški viri imena Buda Castle. Doncsecztalk 17:14, 9 February 2011 (UTC)
In the English language is likely constitute the names, if the grammatical build also allow of. My partner in the Hungarian Wikipedia perfect in English and she also support this name. Doncsecztalk 17:20, 9 February 2011 (UTC)
I was like moved in Prekmurje dialect: i don't for the present the new name, but i persist the name prekmurščina as utmost source use this name in Slovene language. Doncsecztalk 17:25, 9 February 2011 (UTC)
I have yet to meet a qualified Slovenian => English translator or at least one such translator in training and/or a native English speaker who would actually prefer 'Prekmurian' to 'Prekmurje'. While 'Prekmurian' is used by locals and Slovenes in general, it is used more or less jokingly or in a non-serious context, similarly to 'Over-Mura (moving cake)' and similar examples. I recognize the possibility that some Slovene authors use the 'Prekmurian' adjective but that doesn't make it the norm by itself. The English pages are primarily for English speakers and they will, as a rule, use 'Prekmurje' so I would say that the version preferred by native speakers should take precedence. On the topic of dialect:language, professional opinions in Slovenia differ. The more Slovenia-centric linguists argue that Prekmurščina is nothing more than a dialect of Slovene. Ideologically unbiased linguists, however, at least privately admit that it's a separate language. The Statistical Bureau of Slovenia Eleassar quoted is certainly the official point of view but one could argue that it is severely biased and does not necessarily reflect real circumstances, as it is the case with certain minorities not being officially recognized in Slovenia etc. Personally I am in favor of the 'separate language' theory, since the differences between Prekmurščina and Slovene are (common opinion, though scientifically unproven) larger than between Slovene and certain other south Slavic languages e.g. Croatian. Historically it is a question of choosing a reference point in time, which can be used to prove either that it's a language or a dialect. It is clear, however, that modern Prekmurščina lacks any kind of official standardization, then again, so do many other >languages<. The argument I would use for using 'language' instead of 'dialect' is that if different versions of English, German, Spanish, Portuguese etc. can all be referred to as different languages or at least language variants, as opposed to dialects of English, then Prekmurščina (and many other dialects) deserve the same courtesy. However, as the joke goes - A language is a dialect supported by an army. And Prekmurje doesn't have one. Benf86 User talk:Benf86 2:04, 13 August 2011 (UTC)
"The issue of how Prekmurian came to be a separate tongue has many theories. First, in the 16th century, there was a theory that the Slovenes east of the Mura were descendants of the Vandals, an East Germanic tribe of pre-Roman Empire era antiquity. The Vandal name was used not only as the "scientific" or ethnological term for the Slovenes, but also to acknowledge that the Vandalic people were named the Szlovenci, szlovenszki, szlovenye (Slovenians)."
This is more terrible than the Sándor Mikola's theory. Doncsecztalk 07:55, 15 January 2012 (UTC)Sorry. It is as terrible. Doncsecztalk 08:01, 15 January 2012 (UTC)
Does anyone have information and sources about the pronouniciation of ö and ü in the Prekmurje dialect? Could they really be [ø] and [y]? And if so, where did they came from? --Kreuzkümmel (talk) 19:01, 27 January 2012 (UTC)
No Kreuzkümmel, this is pure ö and ü, listen to this recording! The first Prekmurian written documents also clearly trying to indicated the ü and ö. Doncsecztalk 19:23, 27 January 2012 (UTC)
Yes, Kreuzkümmel, ö = [ø] and ü = [y]. These phonemes are not unique to the Prekmurje dialect (e.g., ü is also found in some Karst and Inner Carniolan dialects). Both long and short ü < *u (e.g., duša > düša 'spirit'), probably in a push-chain process as syllabic l̩ > u, as well as via labialization of i > ü (e.g., sirotka > sürotka 'orphan'). The phoneme ö (environmentally conditioned, sometimes with only phonetic status) developed from short e after labials and before -u̯ and -o̯ < ł (e.g., Böltinci 'Beltinci', völki 'wolves'large'). Another source of ö is the later change ür > ör (e.g., širši > šürši > šörši 'wider'), so that the position before r conditioned ü > ö rather than a labial being necessary. Doremo (talk) 11:32, 28 January 2012 (UTC)
And also in the dialect of Prlekija, Slovene gorice, Haloze is very frequent. Doncsecztalk 13:12, 28 January 2012 (UTC)
But Doremo, and Kruz, the Slovene dialectological works also used the ü and ö characters, not y. The y in the dialectology identifical with the ü? This is unable. Doncsecztalk 18:54, 28 January 2012 (UTC)
Doremo, are you sure that "völki" means "wolves"? Personally, I would say that the singular is "vuk" and plural "vuki" and I'd much sooner say that "völki" is a variant of "large" [veuki/velki]. Benf86 (talk) 17:49, 17 February 2012 (UTC)
I think perhaps there should be two separate articles, one for the Prekmurje dialect group and another for the Prekmurje literary language, per references added. Per (Martina Orožen. Vprašanja prekmurskega knjižnega jezika), the Prekmurje literary language cannot be equaled with neither of the speech systems currently present in Prekmurje. --Eleassar my talk 15:49, 22 March 2012 (UTC)
Now I understand. Well there was a initiation in the Slovene wikipedia about the literary language (Prekmurska knjižna norma), and another article dealt with the spoken language (sl:Prekmurščina). The initiation has not yet been achieved. Doncsecztalk 05:55, 23 March 2012 (UTC)
Here i have a little linguistic endorsement, observation about the Prekmurian language (which was not entirely studied or ignored) comparing to the Centum languages;
examples of words:
literal Slovene: drugje(elsewhere), Prekmurian(current, archaic): INDRI which drives correlation with German "andere" (OTHER), French: outres. Consequently; Slovene: "nikjer" (nowhere) vs Prekmurian "nindri". & Slovene "vsepovsod" (everywhere) vs Prekmurian "sindri" (or also "(fse) sešeron") Another comparison; Slovene: davno, nekoč (once upon a time, long time ago, in antique, in ancient time) vs Prekmurian INDA (example in sentence "Inda svejta" (svejt = slavic svet: "world, light, bright") where again draws a similarity with Germanic Ende or Sanskrit term "ANTA"(at the end of something/beginning (so transmutation of the word ANTA went into INDA or vice versa in Premurian; "in the beginning (long time ago). So Inda - Anta - "Antsiend" - Ancient - Antique (-"India-Inda"(??))
Slovene "vedno" (always; which derives from Slovenian "Veda" (knowledge; "which is known"(and "sure") vs Prekmurian "sigdar". (is there any correlation perhaps with germanic "sicher" (sure)??
Or English word "pick"(hack) (in Literal Slovene as "kramp"), which is Prekmurian Pijk (Peeyk). English "Or", Prekmurian "Ar". There seems to be a correlation with ancient Saxonic(English) languages and Vandalic (Prekmurian). — Preceding unsigned comment added by 195.210.253.197 (talk) 13:45, 6 January 2014 (UTC)
- verb "Bagzivati, bagzyati" ("to breed"("making"-offspring (among animals) - probably shares lingual root with Latin "Fecit"(Fik)", Venetic Fagsto, "to make" (transmutation/betatism of F(V)into B or even Ph in several other IE languages); also a "bak" in Lingua Vandalica (Prekmurian) as a rabbit male.— Preceding unsigned comment added by 109.182.163.145 (talk • contribs) 18:31, 25 January 2014 (UTC)
There is research about the archaism of Prekmurian (Zinka Zorko: Most of the archaisms of the Prekmurian there.), but this research is different (about other elements) of my knowledge. Doncsecztalk 09:09, 7 January 2014 (UTC)
Doremo, I am not interested into your theories about Prekmurian language according to pro Serbian and pro "Slovene" academy of Ljubljana. I am writing here my own studies (everyone can study them by themselves) about Prekmurian language for the whole world. To capture and explain few words before they will be assimilated official Slovenian or ex Yugoslav languages and vanish forever. Regards to the word Indri(elsewhere). It shares the lingual root with Indo European, centum word for "andere, other". And Inda derives from Indo European, Centum word Anta. No other way around. Regards to Bezlaj. He never understood or spoke Prekmurian that's why his "transliterations" of Prekmurian language can not be considered as a reliable source of information. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 109.182.165.168 (talk) 23:13, 9 January 2014 (UTC)
Seamless Wikipedia browsing. On steroids.
Every time you click a link to Wikipedia, Wiktionary or Wikiquote in your browser's search results, it will show the modern Wikiwand interface.
Wikiwand extension is a five stars, simple, with minimum permission required to keep your browsing private, safe and transparent.