Hello and welcome to the user talk page for Metaeducation. If you would like to respond to a comment I have left for you, then please—leave the discussion where it is and don't fragment it for my sake! Just put a note giving me a heads up that you have added to the conversation, and provide a link if you are able.
I'd love it if before commenting you could take a moment (an hour?) to read my user page. It contains some amount of information about my editorial opinions, so if we just have a fundamental philosophical difference we can go straight to that instead of re-deriving it via discussion. I will frequently provide links instead of retyping lamer versions of arguments I've already made, and this is never intended to slight you. Just a device to save time, and maybe even enlist you to help upgrade my writing so it has more value.
Please notice that I have a very aggressive stance on "refactoring", and I hope that any discussion we have can be refined and migrated to more appropriate destinations, such as:
- An update to our user pages of personal wiki/editing philosophy
- An update to a policy page
- An update to an article's talk page as an "editing guide"
In any event, the talk page is always a scratchpad, feel free to add whatever you like here! Thanks!
I picked your name off the Normalization discussion group because I saw you took an interest in the topic and seemed to have been around a while. I will be proud to contribute to this work because I am very impressed with you and others who have already contributed so much. I do want you to think of normalization as only secondarily a reduction in redundancy. Primarily normalization is properly associating the measurement with the thing measured....
I placed: EF Codd proposed the process of normalization in general and 1st normal form in particular in his extremely influential paper A Relational Model of Data for Large Shared Data Banks Communications of the ACM, Vol. 13, No. 6, June 1970, pp. 377-387. Copyright © 1970, Association for Computing Machinery, Inc
To put that paper into context, the first commercial computers were put into place in about 1952. COBOL was proposed in 1959 and first standardized in 1968. Codd is published in 1970. Codd's work is followed and perhaps eclipsed in 1981 by “Information Engineering”, James Martin and Clive Finkelstein, Savant Institute.
From Codd's paper…, "There is, in fact, a very simple elimination procedure which we shall call normalization." [His term eliminate is misleading, nothing is lost in normalization. Through decomposition nonsimple domains are replaced by "domains whose elements are atomic (nondecomposable) values." He uses the example of a person's "jobhistory" is replaced by lists of simpler elements such as "employer" and "title"],
That short selection emphasizes:
- His conscious coining of the now very common term, normalization
- His emphasis on solving the particular problem of what he called 'nonsimple' domains rather than making broader statements about semantics. Nonsimple is not a coinage that has stuck; it translates into 2005-speak as 'abstract data type' - a fittingly nonsimple term.
The concept of normalization is an essential milestone in the development of modern database design theory. Though Codd writes about data as strictly an input and output of data processing, you can find in his footnotes that he was beginning to think about problems as we do today. He writes, "Naturally, as with any data put into and retrieved from a computer system, the user will normally make far more effective use of the data if he is aware of its meaning."
Codd stated:
- There is, in fact, a very simple elimination* procedure which we shall call normalization. Through decomposition nonsimple domains are replaced by "domains whose elements are atomic (nondecomposable) values."
- * His term eliminate is misleading, as nothing is "lost" in normalization.
In his paper, Codd consciously coined the term normalization and emphasized on solving a the problem of what he called "nonsimple" domains. The latter did not stick, and is currently referred to as abstract data type. Codd wrote about data as strictly an input and output of data processing, however, in some of his footnotes, he wrote, "Naturally, as with any data put into and retrieved from a computer system, the user will normally make far more effective use of the data if he is aware of its meaning."
I read your interest in keeping the discussion on point so I ask you in particular, do you feel that my pp 2 was too much. (My point is to show that Codd's work is a part of a rolling conversation and not an immutable law.)
The other changes are permutations of the kinds of changes I am asking about above... except I wonder about the etiquette of stylistic changes. If the change is not based on an objective standard such as spelling ... then doesn't this process create a lot of disaffection?
Hope to hear from you... Bschmidt 03:46, 29 August 2005 (UTC)
It's official! The first-ever L.A. Wiki Meetup will be occuring on July 25th, 2005. Are you coming? Would you like to help host? More details on the Meetup page. Be sure to check back regularly for updates! - Eric 1 July 2005 03:49 (UTC)
- I disagree with your refactoring policy. Keeping intact archives is important, as original authors may not have wished you to alter what they said months after the fact; I see no reason why one can't summarize important lengthy discussions for easy perusal rather than deleting or removing portions that are inconvenient. I do agree that keeping organized talk pages is important for maintaining intelligible discussions, and am fine with moving new comments to appropriate parts of the talk page where issues are being discussed (sometimes), but when it's truly vital or when the person who originally made the comments wants them moved himself (and sometimes not even in the latter case, if the comments are important for the discussion) should talk pages be dramatically altered. .. But all that's beside the point being discussed, sorry.
- I disagree that it "didn't get much shorter". The current version has 2612 characters; yours had 1779 characters, 68% of the size it had been. But, yes, like you, size isn't my main concern—we're both apparently exclusively worried about what best serves the article, be it large or small. We just disagree, apparently, as to what does that; I think that while the current paragraphs could probably use a little revising (particularly the last intro paragraph, which is overlong and uses too many weasel words), they at least provide all the necessary information in a clear and accurate way, which I didn't feel your version managed in many areas.
- I'll consider making my own pages for my beliefs on this matter, yes; I've already done that to a small extent on my main page with a few things I support, but haven't updated it with a few new conclusions I've come to after arguing with people who truly think that no page can have over three paragraphs in its intro (even though countless featured articles already do). I'm glad to hear that you're not one of those people, and as such will be perfectly willing to discuss ways to ensure that the intro sticks to only the most relevant details and is a high-quality summary and overview of the whole page.
- And yes, my first instinct was to edit your version of the page rather than to just revert and criticize it; I completely understand how frustrating it can be to do an important, large-scale edit and then have it be removed almost immediately. It happened to me the very first time I edited the Jesus page, and on a very minor point, though the issue was eventually resolved. However, considering that the section we're talking about is the opening paragraphs of one of the most widely-visited pages on all of Wikipedia, I think that the best place to make the paragraphs as good as possible is the Talk page, where we have plenty of room to discuss revisions and there's no risk of scaring away new visitors to the page with unfinished changes. I hope you don't mind. -Silence 20:28, 22 October 2005 (UTC)
Thanks for your contribution. Now the lead is better. Vb 09:58, 1 November 2005 (UTC)
see updated comments on R.D.H. (Ghost In The Machine) talk page as of 17:56, 26 December 2005 (UTC)
Thanks for the heads-up. I have heard of Fabian Pascal: he's a disciple of Chris Date and Hugh Darwen. I once requested an exam copy of his book, Practical Issues in Database Management, which I had expected to be quite good, but it got lost somehow (I got paperwork but no book). Now, though, he has plummeted in my esteem: I hold in contempt anyone who engages in ad hominem attacks rather than reasoned argument.
Thanks again, EmmetCaulfield 18:52, 16 October 2006 (UTC)
Hi. There's an ongoing thread at foundation-l about the Wikipedia logo problems. I've just replied to someone who was asking about what is on "the other side" of the globe, with the only info I know, which is your 3d model! (as linked from Wikipedia:Wikimedia logos)
I was wondering if there were any more details or finished pieces that came out of that project? Definitely an intriguing start :) --Quiddity 08:53, 27 June 2007 (UTC)
- Hi Quiddity, glad you found that thread and that people are talking about this idea. My interest dropped after making that character chart you found, when I couldn't really get anyone too excited about it. If there is renewed interest then I hope that it can be picked up where that work left off, it seems the blender models and tutorial video are still online. And I just uploaded the puzzle ball animation to YouTube, so maybe that can help spread the meme.
- I'm still fairly certain that Blender (software) is a great candidate for the model, given that it's an open source tool available to everybody. But I lost interest in learning the program myself when I found that it is a somewhat traditional program that does not suit well to parameterization. For my own learning of 3D, I'm more interested in the approaches used in programs like SolidWorks, but that's not open source! In any case, I think the modeling work would be best delegated to skilled Blender users...Hazard did an excellent job so far, and it seems others are fluent in it too.
- I definitely think the appearance of Wikipedia and publicity materials benefit from a truly scalable 3D logo, that could be re-rendered in various ways. And as someone mentioned, it could make a great fundraiser toy to actually manufacture the ball (if we just figured out what was on the back of it). Metaeducation 19:13, 28 June 2007 (UTC)
- Just slightly off-topic, I thought you could be interested in this discussion concerning the puzzle globe article :) Also, I'd like to hear your opinion on merging Wikipedia:Wikimedia logos#Wikipedia to Wikipedia:Logos and slogans#Logos (actually, I'd even split this last one in two, but that could be a next move. Oh, and btw, I just loved your 3D model ideas. I hope you or someone finishes it sometime :) And lovely chart too, I'd undoubtly add that to the logo page (and will do so once - if - the merging is done). In any case, I'd like your permission to upload it to commons -- or even better, do it yourself :) Waldir talk 07:42, 16 November 2007 (UTC)
- I just merged (finally!) Wikipedia:Wikimedia logos#Wikipedia and Wikipedia:Logos and slogans#Logos (which is now located at Wikipedia:Slogans) into Wikipedia:Wikipedia logos. Just though you'd like to know. I still have to merge m:Meta:Historical/Logo history into that, but I'll get there! Cheers, Waldir talk 18:01, 9 April 2008 (UTC)
Hi, do you still need textures for the Wikipedia logo? I don't have the exact same font, but I can provide an SVG file for Korean "위" if you want. --Kjoonlee 15:57, 21 May 2008 (UTC)
- Image:Hangul wi.svg --Kjoonlee 23:04, 21 May 2008 (UTC)
Hi User:Metaeducation; I'm working on this too, in POV-Ray. :-) I have some research on characters at m:Talk:Errors in the Wikipedia logo if that's any help to you. --tiny plastic Grey Knight ⊖ 14:07, 23 July 2008 (UTC)
There is currently a thread on the foundation mailing list, discussing both a 3d version of the globe with the hidden pieces filled in, as well as the problems seen in the current logo. Just a heads up. Looks like it might have more momentum this time around :) -- Quiddity (talk) 18:57, 25 July 2008 (UTC)
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| Wik-Ed Women editing session (1/20, 6-10pm) | |
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Dear fellow Wikipedian, Please join us at an event this coming Tuesday: the third Wik-Ed Women editing session will take place on January 20 from 6pm to 10pm at the Los Angeles Contemporary Archive downtown. This series of informal get-togethers is designed to encourage Los Angeles women-in-the-arts (though all are welcome!) to contribute their expertise to Wikipedia, specifically expanding content about women artists. Please RSVP here if you plan to attend. I hope to see you there! Calliopejen1 (talk) - via MediaWiki message delivery (talk) 23:06, 15 January 2015 (UTC) Join our Facebook group here! To opt out of future mailings about LA meetups, please remove your name from this list. | |
| Redondo Loves Wikipedia (2/14), Wik-Ed Women (2/17), and Unforgetting LA at the Getty (2/21)! | |
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.jpg) Dear fellow Wikipedian, The LA Wikipedia community has three events in mid-February -- please consider attending! First, we have a Valentine's Day edit-a-thon appropriately named Redondo Loves Wikipedia, which will take place at the Redondo Beach Public Library from 10am to 1pm on Saturday, February 14. Join library staff, the Redondo Beach Historical Society, and others to help improve Wikipedia's coverage of Redondo Beach! Second, we have a Wik-Ed Women editing session on Tuesday, February 17 from 6pm to 10pm at the Los Angeles Contemporary Archive downtown. This series of informal get-togethers is designed to encourage Los Angeles women-in-the-arts (though all are welcome!) to contribute their expertise to Wikipedia, specifically expanding content about women artists. Third, we have an Unforgetting LA event put on by East of Borneo in collaboration with the Getty Research Institute. Come help improve Wikipedia's coverage of LA design and architecture, and have an awesome free day at the museum -- parking will be validated for edit-a-thon participants! If you'd like to use particular books from GRI's great collection, be sure to email before 2/13 (instructions at event page). And be sure to check out our main meetup page, because we already have three SoCal events scheduled for early March! I hope to see you there! Calliopejen1 (talk) - via MediaWiki message delivery (talk) 18:58, 5 February 2015 (UTC) Join our Facebook group here! To opt out of future mailings about LA meetups, please remove your name from this list. | |
| Wadewitz memorial edit-a-thon (3/18), Redondo Loves Wikipedia (3/28) | |
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 Dear fellow Wikipedian, The LA Wikipedia community has two events in this second half of March -- please consider attending! First, there is a memorial edit-a-thon in honor of the prolific LA Wikipedian Adrianne Wadewitz, which is being held downtown on March 18 (tomorrow!) from noon to 8pm as a part of the American Society for Eighteenth-Century Studies' annual conference. Please drop by to contribute your own work or teach other users how to write for Wikipedia. Second, there will be an event at the Redondo Beach Public Library (following up on last month's session), in collaboration with the Redondo Beach Historical Society. Please join us from 10am to noon on Saturday, March 28 at the main branch of the Redondo Beach Public Library! I hope to see you there! Calliopejen1 (talk) - via MediaWiki message delivery (talk) 22:41, 17 March 2015 (UTC) Join our Facebook group here! To opt out of future mailings about LA meetups, please remove your name from this list. | |
| 5th Annual Wiknic (Saturday, July 11, 2015, ~9:30am-4pm) | |
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 Dear fellow Wikipedian, You are cordinally invited to the fifth annual Los Angeles Wiknic! The Wiknic is a part of the nationwide Great American Wiknic. We'll be grilling, getting to know each other better, and building the L.A. Wikipedia community! The event is tentatively planned for Pan-Pacific Park (map) and will be held on Saturday, July 11, 2014 from 9:30am to 4pm or so. Please RSVP and volunteer to bring food or drinks if possible! I hope to see you there! Howcheng (talk) - via MediaWiki message delivery (talk) 19:41, 21 June 2015 (UTC) Join our Facebook group here! To opt out of future mailings about LA meetups, please remove your name from this list. | |
| 5th Annual Wiknic rescheduled to Saturday, July 25, 2015, ~9:30am-4pm | |
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 Due to a conflict with the Redondo Loves Wikipedia edit-a-thon, the fifth annual Los Angeles Wiknic has been rescheduled. As before, the location will be at Pan-Pacific Park (map) and will be held on Saturday, July 25, 2015 from 9:30am to 4pm or so. Please RSVP and volunteer to bring food or drinks if possible! I hope to see you there! —howcheng {chat} - via MediaWiki message delivery (talk) 04:28, 7 July 2015 (UTC) Join our Facebook group here! To opt out of future mailings about LA meetups, please remove your name from this list. | |
You are invited to join the Women in Architecture edit-a-thon @ Getty Center in LA on October 15! (drop-in any time, 10am-4pm)--Pharos (talk) 18:25, 14 October 2015 (UTC)
Hi,
You appear to be eligible to vote in the current Arbitration Committee election. The Arbitration Committee is the panel of editors responsible for conducting the Wikipedia arbitration process. It has the authority to enact binding solutions for disputes between editors, primarily related to serious behavioural issues that the community has been unable to resolve. This includes the ability to impose site bans, topic bans, editing restrictions, and other measures needed to maintain our editing environment. The arbitration policy describes the Committee's roles and responsibilities in greater detail. If you wish to participate, you are welcome to review the candidates' statements and submit your choices on the voting page. For the Election committee, MediaWiki message delivery (talk) 13:01, 23 November 2015 (UTC)
Hi. I don't get the logic nor the rational for change of an initial redirect of dynamic ip address to Dynamic Host Configuration Protocol being changed to ip address... If someone was looking for IP Address by itself wouldn't they take the lesser and simpler steps of simply writing ip address? Instead dynamic ip address is now redirected to IP Address. Why would someone take the extra step to add an extra word to end up at a place that they specifically didn't want to be, is the nature of my question? I typed in dynamic ip address - using Wikipedia because I was trying to utilize Wikipedia as a timesaver - and instead had to read the portion of the article to recall the terminology and it defeated the entire point of using Wikipedia as a time saver... Now that I am off-topic of my original quest (having spent the last 10-15 minutes retracing what happened & why) I am now petitioning you for an explanation of your logic, in addition to a petition of cooperative spirit to change it back to Dynamic Host Configuration Protocol... Regards, Steve Stevenmitchell (talk) 16:38, 9 January 2016 (UTC)
| Wik-Ed Women Session #5 | |
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 Dear fellow Wikipedian, I would like to personally invite you to the March edition of the Wik-Ed Women meetup, which will take place on March 15, from 6-10 in the evening. It will occur at Los Angeles Contemporary Archive, 2245 E Washington Blvd, Los Angeles, California 90021 (downtown LA -- map). The building has a pink top with old signage for American Accessories, Inc. dba Princess Accessories (Photos [PDF]). There is on-site parking in the back, which also has an entrance. If you cannot attend in person, you are more than willing to work remotely, as we appreciate all help that you can provide. Finally, here is a link to the Facebook event, in case you want to invite friends, as we are always looking for new editors to help expand coverage of women on Wikipedia! I hope to see you there! Cosmicphantom (talk) - via MediaWiki message delivery (talk) 05:54, 15 March 2016 (UTC) Join our Facebook group here! To opt out of future mailings about LA meetups, please remove your name from this list. | |
| LA Wikipedia Day Celebration (February 18) | |
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 Dear fellow Wikipedian, Please join us at our Wikipedia Day celebration at the Ace Hotel in downtown Los Angeles on Saturday, February 18, 2017 from 11 am to 5 pm! This event will feature lectures, panel discussions, lightning talks, open space discussions and collaboration, and--most importantly--cake! Please RSVP on the event page if you're thinking of joining us. I hope to see you there! Calliopejen1 (talk) - via MediaWiki message delivery (talk) 16:35, 2 February 2017 (UTC) Join our Facebook group here! To opt out of future mailings about LA meetups, please remove your name from this list. | |
| LA Meetup: 6th Wiknic, 7/15 @ Pan Pacific Park | |
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 Dear fellow Wikipedian, You are cordially invited to the 6th Los Angeles Wiknic, a part of the nationwide Great American Wiknic. We'll be grilling, getting to know each other better, and building the L.A. Wikipedia community! The event is planned for Pan-Pacific Park and will be held on Saturday, July 15, 2017 from 9:30am to 4pm or so. Please RSVP and volunteer to bring food or drinks if possible! I hope to see you there! Howcheng (talk) - via MediaWiki message delivery (talk) 19:02, 26 May 2017 (UTC) Join our Facebook group here! To opt out of future mailings about LA meetups, please remove your name from this list. | |
| LA Meetup: September 7 edit-a-thon near DTLA | |
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 Dear fellow Wikipedian, You have been invited to a meetup and edit-a-thon at the LA84 Foundation in Jefferson Park (near DTLA) on Thursday, September 7, 2017 from 5:45 p.m. to 9:00 p.m.! This event aims to improve coverage of female Olympians and Paralympians (some of whom will be attending!). There will be a deejay and food/drinks, and kids are welcome. I hope to see you there! Calliopejen1 (talk) - via MediaWiki message delivery (talk) 14:10, 2 September 2017 (UTC) Join our Facebook group, follow our Twitter account, and like our Facebook page!! To opt out of future mailings about LA meetups, please remove your name from this list. | |
| Wikipedia Day LA 2018 | |
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Please join us from 10:00 am - 5:00 pm on Saturday, March 31st for Wikipedia Day LA 2018 at the Ace Hotel in downtown Los Angeles. There will be speakers, panel discussions, a presentation on Wikidata, flash sessions, and a discussion about the formation of an LA User Group. There could be dramatic readings of LA-related talk pages, and there will be truly excellent cake. Please RSVP on the event page if you're thinking of joining us. We hope to see you there! JSFarman (talk) via MediaWiki message delivery (talk) 03:19, 9 March 2018 (UTC) To opt out of future mailings about LA meetups, please remove your name from this list. | |
| LA County Civic Arts Datathon! | |
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Please join us for the LA County Arts Commission Civic Art Wikipedia Edit-a-thon. Beginners are welcome! We'll provide training for new editors. Bob Hope Patriotic Hall, 1816 S. Figueroa St., Los Angeles, CA 90015. To opt out of future mailings about LA meetups, please remove your name from this list. | |
Sunday, September 30, 11:00-4:00 PM
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Hang out. Consume crowd-sourced BBQ! Bask in the glory of late September in Los Angeles (and the glory
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We hope to see you there! JSFarman (talk) 02:50, 9 September 2018 (UTC)
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Who: All Wikipedians & Wikimedians
What: Southern California Regional mini Unconference.
When: Sunday 3 March 2019, 2:00PM PST / 1400 until 4:10PM PST / 1610
Where: Philippe's at Chinatown, Los Angeles
Sponsor: San Diego Wikimedians User Group ( US-SAN )
Your host: RightCowLeftCoast (talk · contribs)
Please add your username to our attendees list so we know how many will be attending, due to the limited size of the cafe.
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| Wikipedia Day LA 2019 Consider the Source | |
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 Please join the LA User Group, Wikimedians of Los Angeles, for an afternoon of panels, presentations and conversations on the subject of sources, and cake (locally sourced), in celebration of Wikipedia's 18th birthday. The Ace Hotel (DTLA) 929 S Broadway, Los Angeles, CA 90015For more details or to sign up, see Wikipedia Day LA, or RSVP via Eventbrite. Everyone is welcome! We hope to see you there. MediaWiki message delivery (talk) 22:00, 18 February 2019 (UTC) To opt out of future mailings about LA meetups, please remove your name from this list. | |
| Art+Feminism 2019 Los Angeles Events! | |
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 Dear fellow Wikipedian, You are invited to join Art+Feminism's annual worldwide Wikipedia edit-a-thon and help close Wikipedia's gender gap at one of these Los Angeles–area museums this March! RSVP/Details here.
These Los Angeles events are co-hosted by online magazine East of Borneo and include step-by-step Wikipedia instruction for beginners. Bring your laptop or tablet computer and any reference materials you'd like to work from or share. People of all gender expressions and identities are encouraged to attend. | |
- MediaWiki message delivery (talk) 04:06, 3 March 2019 (UTC)
| UC Irvine edit-a-thon on May 17, 2019 | |
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 Dear fellow Wikipedian, You are cordially invited to an edit-a-thon this Friday in Orange County, focused on gender equity. The event is a collaboration between UCI and Women in Red. 10:00 am – 4:00 pm PDT (UTC-7) Langson Library, Room 228, at University of California, Irvine Points of contact:
For more details, including the registration link, please see the meetup page. Everyone is welcome! We hope to see you there. | |
--Rosiestep (talk) 00:36, 14 May 2019 (UTC) via MassMessaging
Who: All members of the public
What: Southern California Wiknic & Bonfire.
When: Sunday 1 September 2019, 2:00PM PDT / 1400 until 10:00PM PDT / 2200
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Your host: RightCowLeftCoast (talk · contribs)
Please add your username to our attendees list so we know how many will be attending, and please add your intended potluck contribution to the list.
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In: User:Metaeducation#My_Paranormal_Leanings / second paragraph / last sentence you write:
Like psychiatry, they force limited viewpoints on their victims, and charge them huge amounts of money for assistance that is largely ineffective.
Whom do you mean with "they": The Church of Scientology, or CCHR or ...?
In which way do they force their viewpoints on their victims?
Whom do you consider "victims"?
What is your source for "assistance that is largely ineffective"?
Did you try it yourself?
I would suggest and apppreciate, if you would squeeze in your answers right below the appropriate question.
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| LA to FA 2022 | |
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 Dear Metaeducation, You're invited to a zoom call, taking place on February 11, with the goal of improving the article on Los Angeles to Featured article status! I often find it daunting to approach the Big Subjects on my own—so if you, like me, want a time to sit down with fellow dedicated editors and tackle something important and complex, this is the zoom for you! I, unfortunately, have no way to transmit snacks over zoom; but I trust you to exercise good judgement and discretion in selecting snacks of your own. Hope to see you there—if you're interested, add your name here! theleekycauldron (talk • contribs) (they/she) 00:19, 10 January 2022 (UTC) To opt out of future mailings about LA meetups, please remove your name from this list. | |
| Edit-a-thon and Wikipedia Day Celebration | |
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 Please join Wikimedians of Los Angeles on Saturday, February 17 from 12:00 to 4:00 pm for a Los Angeles and West Hollywood-themed edit-a-thon at the West Hollywood Library. (For the details and to sign up, see Wikipedia:Meetup/Los Angeles/February 2024.) We'll also be celebrating Wikipedia's 23rd birthday/Wikipedia Day. (There will be cake!) We hope to see you there! JSFarman via MediaWiki message delivery (talk) 20:04, 1 February 2024 (UTC) | |
 The Return of the LA Wiknic | |
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| Eat, drink, and bask in the glory of Los Angeles in early June at the 9th not-annual Wiknic! Saturday, June 8 from 11:30 to 2:30 pm | |
MediaWiki message delivery (talk) 15:21, 30 May 2024 (UTC)
 Please join WikiLA at an edit-a-thon to improve and create articles related to marine life and the ocean in the Los Angeles area. Inspiration courtesy of the public library in Manhattan Beach, one of SoCal's most beautiful coastal communities.
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MediaWiki message delivery (talk) 14:56, 16 August 2024 (UTC)
Wikiwand in your browser!
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Every time you click a link to Wikipedia, Wiktionary or Wikiquote in your browser's search results, it will show the modern Wikiwand interface.
Wikiwand extension is a five stars, simple, with minimum permission required to keep your browsing private, safe and transparent.
