User talk:BrownHairedGirl/Archive/Archive 017
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This is an archive of past discussions. Do not edit the contents of this page. If you wish to start a new discussion or revive an old one, please do so on my current talk page |
I have not been able to find out much more about Duckworth than is already in your article.
The only additional information I tracked down about his political career is that he was adopted as Liberal candidate at Blackpool in 1903.(The Times, 19 October 1903) The sitting Tory MP, H W Worsley-Taylor KC announced he would be resigning his seat and the Unionists adopted Wilfrid Ashley. Duckworth and Ashley started campaigning in Blackpool in anticipation of a by-election (The Times, 27 January 1904 p4). In the event Worsley-Taylor did not step down until the 1906 general election when Ashley succeeded him as the local MP.
Duckworth was also a Justice of the Peace and an Alderman of Rochdale. (Walford's County Families of the United Kingdom. 1920 p357)
An odd discrepancy seems to exist about his marriage. I note in your article that by 1862 he is recorded as having a wife and son. However according to Who was Who (OUP 2007) he did not marry until 1882 when he married , Ellen Matilda the daughter of Thomas Jully of Bristol. There is also a Who was Who entry for Duckworth's son, also James Duckworth which states he was born in 1869. That does not accord with the 1862 date or the marriage date as being 1882. I could not find a reference to the marriage elsewhere so it's a mystery.
Please use this info to expand your article if you want.
Graham --Graham Lippiatt (talk) 19:56, 4 May 2009 (UTC)
Based on community consensensus as found on WP:ANI#Temporary three way topic ban, I am enacting a topic ban on the subject of Baronets (edits, articles, and policy pages inclusive) on Vintagekits and Kittybrewster, as well as mandating that you do not use administrative tools on the same topic.
http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Wikipedia%3ARequests_for_arbitration&diff=287957652&oldid=287954949--Tznkai (talk) 00:32, 5 May 2009 (UTC)
Please trim your statement on requests for arbitration
Thank you for making a statement in an Arbitration application on requests for arbitration. We ask all participants and commentators to limit the size of their initial statements to 500 words. Please trim your statement accordingly. If the case is accepted, you will have the opportunity to present more evidence. Neat, concisely presented statements are much more likely to be understood and to influence the decisions of the Arbitrators.
For the Arbitration Committee. Tiptoety talk 14:34, 5 May 2009 (UTC)
- Thanks for the msg. Too many issues raised to condense easily, but I will work on it later this evening. --BrownHairedGirl (talk) • (contribs) 17:48, 5 May 2009 (UTC)
- I have noticed that you have yet to shorten your statement. Might I recommend an easy way to do so? Leave the most important content at RFAR (up to 500 words), then put the rest on a subpage of your userspace and link to it at RFAR. Cheers, Tiptoety talk 23:07, 6 May 2009 (UTC)
- Or, you could read the actual policy and see that that 1000-word limit explicitly refers to evidence posted after the case is accepted, and the only guidance in terms of length for statements before a case is accepted is "While it is not necessary to lay out the entire case, the Committee will expect you to briefly outline the nature of the dispute and the steps already taken to resolve it", which is exactly what both BHG and Vintagekits have done, and either point out the place where it limits them to 1000 words or stop trying to enforce a non-existent policy… (The 500 word limit is for the summary posted by the initial filer of the case, not for those responding to it.) – iridescent 23:50, 6 May 2009 (UTC)
- Um, alright. I am not sure what provoked that. Anyways, I ask that you please look at Wikipedia:Requests for arbitration/How-to. If I am reading it right, it asks parties to keep it around 500 words. Cheers, Tiptoety talk 00:38, 7 May 2009 (UTC)
- The 500 word limit is applied across the board to try to keep opinions tight. Clerks have often asked for the additional statements to be trimmed down to 500 words, so this isnt anything new, but maybe it hasnt been written into the guide, or maybe it has been lost. The how-to says that "Arbitrators or Clerks may summarily remove or refactor discussion without comment". Obviously Tip isnt suggesting that he will do that here; BHG is a party, her statement is very helpful, and she has added auxiliary responses to Arb questions, so it may not be possible to push it under the 500 words. John Vandenberg (chat) 00:56, 7 May 2009 (UTC)
- I read the guidance, saw that the 500-word limit applied to those requesting arbitration, and thought that it would be nice to get mine down to that limit even tho the guidance didn't seem to require it. So I wrote what I needed to say, edited down, and when it got stuck at about 1000 words (about half the original) I gave up and posted it.
- After Tiptoety's message yesterday, I tried again to edit it, but wasn't able to reduce it significantly without omitting crucial points. I do understand the merits of succinctness at this stage, but is it really so pressing an issue that's worthwhile spending more time trying to trim it? John seems happy enough with it as it is, so if it's OK with others, I'll leave it be. --BrownHairedGirl (talk) • (contribs) 01:05, 7 May 2009 (UTC)
- If it is OK with ArbCom, than it is OK with me. I am simply enforcing a guideline set forth by ArbCom to make their jobs a little easier. Anyways, I appreciate your efforts BrownHairedGirl in attempting to reduce your statement. Cheers, Tiptoety talk 02:10, 7 May 2009 (UTC)
- Thanks! --BrownHairedGirl (talk) • (contribs) 02:16, 7 May 2009 (UTC)
- If it is OK with ArbCom, than it is OK with me. I am simply enforcing a guideline set forth by ArbCom to make their jobs a little easier. Anyways, I appreciate your efforts BrownHairedGirl in attempting to reduce your statement. Cheers, Tiptoety talk 02:10, 7 May 2009 (UTC)
I decide to take a break from my break and I'm still up at 1.30 fixing stuff. Two issues. Firstly any luck with the bot? And secondly User:CorkMan is a prolific creator of articles how ever, he never cites them or adds {{GaelicGamesProject}} tags too them. Can you have a look at his contribs and let me know what you think Gnevin (talk) 00:39, 7 May 2009 (UTC)
Thank you for your messages. I am very sorry that in a hundred or so new articles which I created I made a couple of mistakes. I tried to conclude their parliamentary career with a neutral statement, except where from various sources other than Leigh Rayment (which doesn't say) it appeared that that they had lost or stood down. Obviously I got some wrong. This problem should only occur within the last 20 or so articles for six-month-wonders which I created so it should be containable. The great thing with wiki is that those with better knowledge of a subject or access to more information can correct simple good faith errors so thank you for doing that. You will be glad to know that there are only six more English 1885 MPs who need articles and I will try to take more care when I do them. That is as far as I am going, as I have no intention of following Gladstone into the quagmire of Hibernian politics. Motmit (talk) 13:31, 7 May 2009 (UTC)
- Replied at User talk:Motmit#George_William_Latham, to keep thread together. --BrownHairedGirl (talk) • (contribs) 13:56, 7 May 2009 (UTC)
Unrelated, but see Capernwray Hall which now has a disambig problem. Motmit (talk) 14:27, 7 May 2009 (UTC)
- I see you have spooted it Motmit (talk) 14:28, 7 May 2009 (UTC)
- (ec)Thanks! I'd just spotted that, and moved the article back. Will write a quick stub on his father and make George Marton a dab page. --BrownHairedGirl (talk) • (contribs) 14:30, 7 May 2009 (UTC)
Can you comment at Wikipedia:Templates_for_deletion/Log/2009_April_24#Two_US_representatives_templates on the proposed solution.--TonyTheTiger (t/c/bio/WP:CHICAGO/WP:LOTM) 18:39, 7 May 2009 (UTC)
On May 8, 2009, Did you know? was updated with a fact from the article Percy Hurd, which you created or substantially expanded. If you know of another interesting fact from a recently created article, then please suggest it on the Did you know? talk page. |
FYI. rootology (C)(T) 04:43, 8 May 2009 (UTC)
- Thanks for the pointer! I have responded at ANI. --BrownHairedGirl (talk) • (contribs) 11:01, 8 May 2009 (UTC)
You are invited to revisit Sean Power (actor) to see if the WP:ENTERTAINER concerns you raised at Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Sean Power (actor) have been adequately addressed. Thank you, Schmidt, MICHAEL Q. 07:50, 9 May 2009 (UTC)
- Thank you for stopping back and offering your input. I took your thoughts inre the notability of the play Stuck and found that it has received multiple awards and nominations, as has Power as being the star of the show. Going through the press and reviews of the play, I pulled out and sourced a few reviews specifically directed at Power.. s critical acclaim and recognition, thus pushing past the GNG a bit more. Again, and speecially after digging and editing, I can well understand your original concerns with the gawd-awful amount of fluff in the earlier versions and the problems with finding sources about so comon a name. Good editing, Schmidt, MICHAEL Q. 00:34, 10 May 2009 (UTC)
- Thank you for that. Your msg crossed in the post with my reply to your earlier highly sarcastic comments, so we are a bit out of sync. I'll take a look again and see whether the new references get there. But really, it doesn't matter whether or not he has had critical acclaim -- that's not what notability is about: what matters is how much independent substatial coverage exists of him, and the critics rating could be good bad or indifferent. General notability is a bit like that old chestnut of "I don't mind what you call me, just call me". --BrownHairedGirl (talk) • (contribs) 00:50, 10 May 2009 (UTC)
- I have posted an apology for my impatience at the AfD. My own understanding is that critical acclaim is just one more valuable way to determine notability, just as film reviews count toward film notability and book reviews count toward book notability, as his creating and giving life to a character in a play and then going on to win multiple awards and nominations based upon his work in it ("The person has received a notable award or honor, or has been often nominated for them"). I consider his service in the entire run of a notable series, his participation in supporting roles in others, and his writing and directing a play that is itself covered in depth. I am less concerned with picking apart the seperate pieces as I am with putting them together so I can look at the entire depth and scope of the individual. And I am also considering WP:CREATIVE, as actors cross that "barrier" between Entertainer and Creator when they must themselves create a character and are not simply following the dictates of a director... this since he "authored" the character of Stan for Stuck, and has indeed "has won significant critical attention" through the reviews and the awards. The pieces fit. And to adress concerns that not all the sources are "in-depth"... well, since the lessor ones are still more than trivial ("If the depth of coverage is not substantial, then multiple independent sources may be needed to prove notability"), they blend well with the more substantial sources to create the mosaic of his life and career. Anyway... thank you again for your temperance. My frustration was not so much directed at you. Best regards, Schmidt, MICHAEL Q. 03:32, 10 May 2009 (UTC)
- Thank you for that. Your msg crossed in the post with my reply to your earlier highly sarcastic comments, so we are a bit out of sync. I'll take a look again and see whether the new references get there. But really, it doesn't matter whether or not he has had critical acclaim -- that's not what notability is about: what matters is how much independent substatial coverage exists of him, and the critics rating could be good bad or indifferent. General notability is a bit like that old chestnut of "I don't mind what you call me, just call me". --BrownHairedGirl (talk) • (contribs) 00:50, 10 May 2009 (UTC)
I have had a look in the Times newspaper archive and Who was Who but there is not anything new there which is not covered in your article. I did make a couple of minor grammar changes.
The odd thing is that in your article you have a source which indicates Duckworth had a wife and son in 1862. However according to Who was Who, Duckworth did not marry until 1882. His wife's name is given as Emma Matilda Jully. Who was Who also has an entry for Duckworth's son also called James but his dob is given as 1869. He contested Bury as a Liberal in 1923 and 1924. I suppose the relationship could have been common law and James junior born out of wedlock with the parents legitimising things by marrying in 1882 but it's speculation and I do not want to add information to the article which appears to contradict the existing content. Does your source say anything about the marriage?
Graham —Preceding unsigned comment added by Graham Lippiatt (talk • contribs) 19:56, 4 May 2009
I hope you don't mind me requesting you look at some pages but the relationships of various FitzRoys have got a bit beyond my expertise. Basically there are several Lord Charles FitzRoys, some of whom were MP for Bury St Edmunds, plus there is Charles Augustus FitzRoy who seems to be redlinked in various places as Lord Charles Augustus Fitzroy or Lord Charles FitzRoy (politician). My confusion is over the 'Lord' title which isn't mentioned at Charles Augustus FitzRoy. (Plus Lord Charles FitzRoy (politician) is listed at the dab page as a different person). No worries if you have no time to look at it, I'll be leaving it be. Thanks. Tassedethe (talk) 14:39, 9 May 2009 (UTC)
- Hi Tassedethe, thanks for the msg. I can usually make resonably good progress on those dabs, having rotted my head enough times on them in the past!
- Unfortunately, I am rather busy at the moment, because the consequences of trying to avert a series of ill-considered mass page moves which messed up disambiguation in this MP/Peer/Baronet territory have landed me at WP:ANI and at WP:RFAR. :(
- I'll try to get back to this once the storm is over (unless I am topic-banned from the field, which for someone reason the arbirators are considering), so if you remind me again in a week or so I'll see what I can do (if I am allowed).
- Otherwise, I suggest a note at WT:PEERAGE, where you should catch the attention of editors such as Choess, Phoe, Tryde, who are very good at this sort of thing. If you don't raise them, then my best suggestion for now is to use www.leighrayment.com as a starting source, and check dates of birth and death v carefully on both the commons constituencies and the peerage pages. These families recycled first names endlessly, and the "Lord" title often indicates a courtesy title used by an heir apparent, so there could well be more than one Lord X Y, some of whom may not actually have acceded to the peerage. If (like me) you don't have access to Burke's or Debrett's, then http://www.thepeerage.com is often very helpful in tracing the family relationships to clarify who was who.
- Hope this helps, and sorry if I am teaching grannies to suck eggs! --BrownHairedGirl (talk) • (contribs)
- No, no granny teaching going on. I realised it was one of those areas where I could make matters worse if I started linking people incorrectly; if people get called Lord who aren't actually lords well that would be even more confusing. I will try your suggestion of a note at WT:PEERAGE. Very sorry about the WP:ANI stuff, I wish you luck in that. Tassedethe (talk) 15:14, 9 May 2009 (UTC)
- Hi Tassedethe, generally only younger sons of dukes and marquesses and grandsons of a sovereign are entitled to the courtesy title "lord", Charles Augustus FitzRoy however was the son of a younger son of a duke (3rd Duke of Grafton) and as such not qualified. the Lord Charles Augustus Fitzroy who represented St Bury on the other hand was a younger son of a duke (4th Duke of Grafton) and is identically with Lord Charles FitzRoy (politician) (already existing on the disambiguation page). The MP from 1761 to 1774 was Charles FitzRoy, 1st Baron Southampton and the MP from 1787 to 1796 as well as from 1802 to 1818 was Lord Charles FitzRoy (British Army officer). Hope this helps, if not, please feel free to ask me directly.
- There appears to be two disambiguation pages: Charles FitzRoy and Lord Charles FitzRoy. They should be merged, particularly since Charles FitzRoy contains a link to Lord Charles FitzRoy which is mistakenly labelled as a link to an article. --BrownHairedGirl (talk) • (contribs) 18:02, 9 May 2009 (UTC)
- I did the merge and I think I have everyone linked to the right people. The MP box on the Charles Augustus FitzRoy page really threw me. Thanks for both your help. Tassedethe (talk) 18:55, 9 May 2009 (UTC)
- There appears to be two disambiguation pages: Charles FitzRoy and Lord Charles FitzRoy. They should be merged, particularly since Charles FitzRoy contains a link to Lord Charles FitzRoy which is mistakenly labelled as a link to an article. --BrownHairedGirl (talk) • (contribs) 18:02, 9 May 2009 (UTC)
- Hi Tassedethe, generally only younger sons of dukes and marquesses and grandsons of a sovereign are entitled to the courtesy title "lord", Charles Augustus FitzRoy however was the son of a younger son of a duke (3rd Duke of Grafton) and as such not qualified. the Lord Charles Augustus Fitzroy who represented St Bury on the other hand was a younger son of a duke (4th Duke of Grafton) and is identically with Lord Charles FitzRoy (politician) (already existing on the disambiguation page). The MP from 1761 to 1774 was Charles FitzRoy, 1st Baron Southampton and the MP from 1787 to 1796 as well as from 1802 to 1818 was Lord Charles FitzRoy (British Army officer). Hope this helps, if not, please feel free to ask me directly.
- No, no granny teaching going on. I realised it was one of those areas where I could make matters worse if I started linking people incorrectly; if people get called Lord who aren't actually lords well that would be even more confusing. I will try your suggestion of a note at WT:PEERAGE. Very sorry about the WP:ANI stuff, I wish you luck in that. Tassedethe (talk) 15:14, 9 May 2009 (UTC)
I am leaving a note here for the benefit of anyone watching my talkpage, because I have launched an RFC at Wikipedia_talk:Naming conventions (names and titles)#Page_names_for_biographical_articles_on_individual_baronets.
My proposal is to stabilise the pagenames of articles on baronets by either forbidding the use of baronet titles in page names or making them universal. I think that either option is an improvement over the status quo, because it removes any scope for dispute over whether baronetcy titles should be applied to individual articles, and that will make life easier for everybody. The current flexibility has been tried for several years, and while I believe that it is workable, in practise it doesn't actually work because too many interested editors have strong views for and against the use of titles. It has ended up being an unsustainable compromise. --BrownHairedGirl (talk) • (contribs) 21:19, 9 May 2009 (UTC)
- Do you have to be reiminded that Kittybrestwer, your mainstay supporter is currently banned from all pages connected to baronets, that will include your RFC. So is this not a little premature? Especially, as the Arbcom are currently debating a topic ban on you from baronets and de-sysoping you? I would suggest you wait silently and patiently before initiating anything else concerned with baronets. Giano (talk) 22:12, 9 May 2009 (UTC)
- Lord and Jimbo forgive me, but I'm going to agree with Giano here. Let someone like Choess, who is equally interested in baronets but hasn't been sucked into this unholy mess, sort out the naming issues. VK and KB, that goes equally for the pair of you, too. It won't kill us to have the article at Sir William Bowyer-Smijth, 11th Baronet instead of William Bowyer-Smijth for another week. – iridescent 22:22, 9 May 2009 (UTC)
- Do you have to be reiminded that Kittybrestwer, your mainstay supporter is currently banned from all pages connected to baronets, that will include your RFC. So is this not a little premature? Especially, as the Arbcom are currently debating a topic ban on you from baronets and de-sysoping you? I would suggest you wait silently and patiently before initiating anything else concerned with baronets. Giano (talk) 22:12, 9 May 2009 (UTC)
Giano seems to be under the illusion that expect support from Kittybrewster on this. Quite the opposite: I have no reason to believe that Kb would agree with my view that no titles at all would be a better option than the status quo.
I have thrown out the suggestion, and I'll see what others make of it. There's no rush, but it seemed to me to be timely to point out that for those who don't care strongly either way about using titles, but just want to handle ambiguity, part of the reason we get caught in the middle is that this is the only set of personal titles where use is neither universal nor deprecated. The reason I did as an RFC was precisely to get it out from beyond the usual crew and see if outside opinion might bring a structural solution.
Anyway, I have floated the idea, and my intention was in any case to sit back and see what others make of the possibility of adopting one of two solutions which would avoid this mess ever happening again. --BrownHairedGirl (talk) • (contribs) 22:48, 9 May 2009 (UTC)
Hi, can I draw your attention to the above user that I see you have some previous experience with. He was previously blocked and said that he would refrain from editing articles with which he has a conflict of interest with in August 2008 yet continues to edit articles related to longevity myths/claims. He has been reported to the WP:COIN which is where I've heard about this. It would be useful if you could take a look at the discussion. Thanks in advance, Smartse (talk) 16:31, 10 May 2009 (UTC)
- Ah here's the specific link to COIN : Wikipedia:Conflict_of_interest/Noticeboard#Longevity_myths.2C_Longevity_claims.2C_etc. Smartse (talk) 16:32, 10 May 2009 (UTC)
- Thanks. I have commented there, but would prefer not to get further involved. --BrownHairedGirl (talk) • (contribs) 17:57, 10 May 2009 (UTC)
Hi, BrownHairedGirl. I did get a bit carried away after working through an exhaustive rationale given the publicity of some Eastern European edit wars that have gotten kind of famous here. As far as Digwuren, I admit that it has been pretty difficult to assume good faith. His edit history strikes me as a bit tendentious. Here, for example, he is deleting a POV tag without bothering to discuss the matter with myself and a concurring editor on the Neo-Stalinism talk page. Of course, the rationale for his vote in the discussion was astounding. PasswordUsername (talk) 21:23, 10 May 2009 (UTC)
- I understand how it can be concerning to see tendentious editing. But as one of CFD's old lags, I really do think you'll find that a CFD nomination gets a much better reception if it is reasonably concise. Straying away from the merits (or otherwise) of the category onto the alleged failings of the category creator also goes down badly. That's just my tuppenceworth. --BrownHairedGirl (talk) • (contribs) 22:12, 10 May 2009 (UTC)
- Thanks, I really should have been more diplomatic. PasswordUsername (talk) 22:21, 10 May 2009 (UTC)
- It's easy to get a bit carried away sometimes :)
- But you can still edit the nomination after posting it .... --BrownHairedGirl (talk) • (contribs) 22:28, 10 May 2009 (UTC)
- Thanks, I really should have been more diplomatic. PasswordUsername (talk) 22:21, 10 May 2009 (UTC)
LOL, that's probably never happened before. What's the limit as far as how long I can make my next nomination? I'm honestly not trying to be ridiculous, but it's annoying when perfectly valid points get passed over in the course of debating. Being a kind of busy last-term university student, I was mainly trying to get things right from the get go, thinking it'd help cut down on having stay up 24/7.
I think I'll give up for a while. PasswordUsername (talk) 04:07, 11 May 2009 (UTC)
- No time limit so far as I am concerned, due to the nature of the closure of closure of that CFD. However, since there was a previous CFD for each of these categories only 5 weeks ago (here and here), your nomination yesterday was somewhat premature. I think you are wise to leave this one for a while, and come back to it later.
- I'm quite sure that you acted in good faith trying to get the nomination right, but the effect was overwhelming. I hope that on reflection you can see why you feel key points were missed in the debate: most contributors were bound to miss them, because they just got lost in all the words.
- Can I tell you how I know that long nominations don't work? It's because of this CFD nomination from May 5. By ... well, by me.<red face> On a subject that would normally bring in half-a-dozen contributors, there's next-to-nothing, and I'm sure that's because there are simply too many words (even though there are only 1/3 as many as you used). I'm going to withdraw that nomination, because it's quite clear that such verbosity doesn't work at CFD. Less is more :)
- You are right that there is no limit, and if you want to appeal my closure you can do so at WP:DRV. But I really really suggest that you would do much better to take a little time to copyedit your nomination down to one what will fit on a maximum of one modestly-sized screen, which in practice probably means less than 500 words. If there is further material you want to present, then consider adding supplementary material on a subpage of your userpage (e.g. User:PasswordUsername/Neo Stalinism categories) ... but I'm pretty sure that you should not need to do that, and should be able to get all the most important points across in much less than 500 words.
- The next is purely a suggestion, in case it helps: one approach to doing that is to decide how many important points you need to make (such as the six you have listed at the top), and set yourself a low word limit for explaining each of them. Six points @ 50 words for each is only 300 words. Omit phrases such as "surprise surprise", "to proceed from the foregoing" -- all those words are un-needed decoration, great in some places but not where brevity matters. Omit criticism of other editors -- all that matters is the categories, not how makes them. And don't use a separate summary at the start. That's great for lengthy report-writing, but not for a short set of key points, where a separate summary requires repetition later. Just make each point succinctly, then the next one, and don't try to make elegant prose -- just simple, concise prose. I know you can do it!
- Hope this helps. I don't want to take a view either way or whether or nor the categories should be deleted, but it does seem to me that you do have done a lot of thinking about the nature of these categories. Whatever view others take or your arguments, I'm sure that it would be good for them to be heard, if you give it some time and organise them better. --BrownHairedGirl (talk) • (contribs) 11:06, 11 May 2009 (UTC)
- Thanks again, I really appreciate the input. I'm getting to be busy IRL right now, but I might bring it up again when I get some free time. PasswordUsername (talk) 11:57, 11 May 2009 (UTC)
- You're welcome! Good luck with finishing up at University. --BrownHairedGirl (talk) • (contribs) 12:23, 11 May 2009 (UTC)
- Thanks again, I really appreciate the input. I'm getting to be busy IRL right now, but I might bring it up again when I get some free time. PasswordUsername (talk) 11:57, 11 May 2009 (UTC)
Dear BHG, if there's one thing I learned about Wikipedia, it's that fanatical editing, rather than level-headed attempts to formulate consensus, often rules on Wikipedia, unless/until the community as a whole finally notices and begins the process of dialing back that particular person. That could be me. It could also be many others. I'm particularly disturbed at both JJBulten's POV pushing AND his scorched-Earth editing. Consider this:
1. JJ Bulten has suggested that Abraham's age of "175" be taken literally
2. He is a major Biblical apologist
3. He has suggested that the biology of humans was different in Biblical times (creationism) and so that longer life spans are possible. (I note that many Christian leaders have come up with explanations for this, but none are taken seriously by scientists).
4. He has suggested that merely finding a photo of Catherine, Countess of Desmond "verifies" her age at 140
5. He has challenged research that has been published in non-Wikipedia sources first as "original research."
6. He has mistaken third-party published research as "self-published" sources.
7. He has inserted his own ORIGINAL RESEARCH. There is no scientific, or even popular use, of terms such as "longevity narratives, longevity stories, longevity folklore." All the sources for this are Wiki-mirrors of the phrases being created on Wikipedia.
Now, I must admit that I am often not the nicest person around and I have to work on that. However, Wikipedia also needs to work on the problem/issue that a single, zealous, POV (in this case, Biblical apologist/literalist) creator can undo/overthrow 130 years of science just because it conflicts with his personal view of the world.
Moreover, this editor admitted that he didn't even read one iota of literature on the subject until he cracked open a Guinness Book last week (which is merely the starting point on the subject, not the scientific literature).
Therefore, the real problem here is the issue of CONTENT: this editor is mis-using Wikipedia to push pro-Christian fundamentalist, anti-scientific POV.
And therein lies the problem.
Ryoung122 17:18, 12 May 2009 (UTC)
- Hi Robert -- thanks for your msg.
- Look, I do acknowledge that you have made great efforts not repeat the mistakes you made before. However, as per my comments at WP:COIN, I think it is inappropriate that you have edited articles about cases where you have been involved, and even edited specifically in relation to your own role in them (e.g. this edit, where you changed the article to attribute research solely to yourself rather than to you and NYT). Whether you are right or wrong on anything else, that's a clear no-no, and you really should stay well clear of such material. If I had not been involved in a previous dispute with you, I would have regarded that alone would have been enough to justify a formal warning to desist.
- I am also troubled by the number of straightforward reverts which you have made of JJB's edits, including several in which you have reverted his addition of {{DEFAULTSORT}} to an article. Have you just been mass-reverting his edits? And your practice of rarely using edit summaries is always bad for collaboration, but particularly bad when you are editing in a controversial area.
- However, as I noted at WP:COIN, I agree that the core issue here is a basic difference between you and JJB in how you approach the whole field ... and that's why I suggest an RFC.
- I don't support either of your sides in all this, but the more I read of this dispute the more I am concerned that both of you seem determined to make one view of this field predominate. You claim to have science on your side, but insisting a scientific approach to the exclusion of all others is just as much a POV as the worldview of a creationist, and it's particularly problematic that the scientific angle is being pushed by someone who has such a prominent role as a protagonist in the real-world disputes.
- WP:NPOV is very clear about handle the application of two opposing frameworks for looking at an issues: present both sides of an argument, and let the reader make up their own minds. Since you two seem unable to agree on a way of doing this, I strongly urge you both to launch an RFC on this dispute and let the wider community sort it out.
- For what it's worth, I am not a creationist or a "biblical apologist" or an adherent of any religion. But when I see two sides both apparently trying to engage in "idea promotion" (which was how you described your own editing), then my alarm bells ring. Wikipedia is not a vehicle for promoting anyone's ideas. --BrownHairedGirl (talk) • (contribs) 17:53, 12 May 2009 (UTC)
- I have just reverted a post to this page by Ryoug122, because it included a huge copy-and-paste of a contribs list. I have asked you before not to clutter up talk pages with this sort of thing: learn how to link to a contribs list rather than just just splattting in material when a short link would not only make for a more readable page here, but make the contribs list more useful. --BrownHairedGirl (talk) • (contribs) 18:28, 12 May 2009 (UTC)
- Hi BHG, please forgive me for jumping in, but I believe it necessary for your page to include my categorical denial (hereby) to the charges 1-7 above, which seem to represent Ryoung122's strange recasting of statements I've made and/or original research on his part about my state of mind. Also I want to affirm your views about NPOV and SPOV above, as has been demonstrated by my use of sourcing, and I would particularly be interested in Ryoung122 getting around to inserting those scientific sources so they can be reviewed in the standard way. Thank you for your patience. JJB 16:43, 13 May 2009 (UTC)
The Arbitration Committee, in Wikipedia:Arbitration/Requests/Case#Baronets naming dispute, have voted to implement a motion. It can be viewed on the case page by following this link. The motion is as follows:
The community enacted topic ban on Vintagekits (talk · contribs · deleted contribs · logs · filter log · block user · block log) and Kittybrewster (talk · contribs · deleted contribs · logs · filter log · block user · block log) is recognized and confirmed. Kittybrewster is admonished to respect community and administrator decisions, including the imposition of sanctions, and directed to utilize the standard channels of appeal and review in cases where he disagrees. Disregard for sanctions, whether imposed by an administrator, the community, or the Arbitration Committee, is grounds for the imposition of escalating blocks and/or further sanctions. Vintagekits and Kittbrewster are indefinitely restricted from moving pages relating to Baronets and Knights, broadly interpreted. They are both restricted from nominating articles created by the other for deletion and more generally warned from unnecessarily interacting with each other, especially where it is likely to be perceived as baiting, trolling, or another form of harassment. BrownHairedGirl (talk · contribs · blocks · protections · deletions · page moves · rights · RfA) is admonished not to use administrative tools to further her own position in a dispute. BrownHairedGirl is prohibited indefinitely from taking any administrative action against or in connection with Vintagekits.
On behalf of the Arbitration Committee, KnightLago (talk) 20:55, 13 May 2009 (UTC)
- Thanks for the notice. --BrownHairedGirl (talk) • (contribs) 00:58, 14 May 2009 (UTC)
Hi BrownHairedGirl:
We've started a new Ireland Wikimedian email list, that you can join, at mail:WikimediaIE. For Wikimedians in Ireland and Wikimedians interested in events in Ireland and efforts in Ireland. To discuss meetups, partnerships with Museums and National Archives, and anything else where Wikipedia and real life intersect :) Bastique demandez 21:20, 13 May 2009 (UTC)
I saw you are using the "HBC Archive Indexerbot" and am trying it out. Perhaps you understand its workings but it is only indexing my existing talk page and not my archived talk pages. By any chance do you know what settings I need to change to get it to index those pages too? Cheers ww2censor (talk) 03:32, 14 May 2009 (UTC)
- Hi ww2c
- I had the call to it on my talk page for over year, but it did absolutely nothing at all. I had studied the instructions a few times, but couldn't figure out what I was doing wrong, and eventually just gave up. :(
- However, this edit by Krellis (talk · contribs) fixed it. I'm not sure that I understand exactly what Krellis did, maybe you could ask Krellis for help in getting yours working? --BrownHairedGirl (talk) • (contribs) 12:03, 14 May 2009 (UTC)
Hi BHG
Long time no see. Glad you've popped back from your extended wikibreak.
I think there's probably good justification for the cricketer being deemed the prime for notability. What do you think?
Cheers and, like I say, good to have you back, even briefly. --Dweller (talk) 15:24, 11 May 2009 (UTC)
- Hi Dweller, thanks for the welcome! Good to see you are still around :)
- I do tend to take a fairly restrictive view of WP:PRIME in general, and I think it's particularly difficult with biographical articles. If choosing between (for example) an Australian judge, a Canadian ice-hockey player, an Irish freedom-fighter and a Scottish writer, I think that they are likely to interest completely different audiences. Many readers may see a particular article as their clear primary topic, but a majority of readers are going to disagree with any particular choice. So when it comes to biographies, I take the view that someone needs to be quite exceptional within their field before being viewed as a the primary topic, and that one should be wary of recentism: it's a mistake, I think, to determine a primary topic by assessing the article rather than the person, because in general newer topics tend to be expanded more quickly.
- On those grounds, I default to having the title page as a dab, which also makes it much easier to ensure that all links go to where they want to, which is a direct reader benefit.
- In this case, it looks to me (and correct me if I'm wrong) that Ellison got fairly near the top of his game, playing for England and wining the Wisden award. Not at the top, though (he wasn't captain) and thanks to injury he wasn't there for long. So he looks to me like someone who could have been one of the great cricketers, but for misfortune; however, the early promise was not fulfilled.
- The article on Richard Ellison (politician) is just a stub, but he was an MP for 24 years, which is well above average for the Commons, and the article doesn't yet provide any info on whether he ever held govt office. However, in the unreformed House of Commons, it tended to be the local big cheeses who got to Parliament (that or someone parachuted in to a pocket borough), so the MP has a possibility of being a more significant character than he initially looks.
- If the MP is just a man of local significance, then the cricketer's claim to national fame puts him ahead, and regardless of that, he has a degree of international fame which the MP lacks. But is he really so much more notable that it's worth sacrificing the ease of maintaining disambiguation? I think not, but it seems like a borderline case. What do you think? --BrownHairedGirl (talk) • (contribs) 16:19, 11 May 2009 (UTC)
Sorry, took me a while to get back here. Your arguments are persuasive and I think I'll go with them. This makes an interesting parallel with the current debate at Talk:Bill O'Reilly, don't you think? --Dweller (talk) 14:37, 14 May 2009 (UTC)
- Courtesy note: I've name-dropped you at Talk:Bill O'Reilly --Dweller (talk) 12:15, 15 May 2009 (UTC)
Hello. These two articles are duplicates. I hope you can help me determine which first name he used, I believe it was Granville but both names appear on the internet. Tryde (talk) 12:33, 14 May 2009 (UTC)
- Thanks Tryde, I had spotted that, and had been about to merge them.
- He was actually known as George -- see Hansard here. --BrownHairedGirl (talk) • (contribs) 09:05, 15 May 2009 (UTC)
- But if you click on his name in that source you end up at a page where he is referred to as Granville Greenwood! The ODNB also calls him Granville Greenwood. This source, which contains a short biography on him by his daughter, calls him George. A bit confusing to say the least. I left a message at Wikiproject Shakespeare (as he was a well-known Shakespearean scholar) about two months ago but no-one bothered to reply. How reliable do you think this Hansard website is anyway, I've found a number of errors in it. Tryde (talk) 09:34, 15 May 2009 (UTC)
- I think I can answer those.
- First, the DNB opens "Greenwood, Sir Granville George (1850–1928), politician and animal welfare reformer, was born in London on 3 January 1850,...". As with other entries, they appear to have made no effort to determine which name he used.
- The Hansard site consists of the text of Hansard, with Rayment's list of MPs used as an index, so the index always uses the firstname even when ppl were known by middle name. However, the name used in the text of Hansard is that recorded by the clerks transcribing the debate, who are often inconsistent, but I have never seen any case of then using the middle name of someone who wasn't known by that name. I just checked his contributions in 1918: every single one of them is either "Sir George Greenwood" or "Sir G. Greenwood". I can only assume that by then the clerks had taken notice of previous objections.
- The piece by his daughter doesn't answer which name he used, and is clearly the source an inaccuracy which has crept into the wikipedia article George Greenwood. She writes "in 1906 he won Peterborough for the Liberals and held it till December, 1915, when forced by rheumatism to retire" ... but he was still speaking in Parliament up to November 1918.. --BrownHairedGirl (talk) • (contribs) 14:15, 15 May 2009 (UTC)
- I'm 99% convinced! I think he may have used both names at times, i.e. Granville George Greenwood or G. G. Greenwood. At amazon.co.uk you cam buy both this book on Shakespeare by Greenwood or this book on Shakespeare by him... Btw, I hope you saw the message I left you about a week ago regarding the VK business. I think it's buried in your latest talk page archive. Tryde (talk) 11:47, 16 May 2009 (UTC)
- But if you click on his name in that source you end up at a page where he is referred to as Granville Greenwood! The ODNB also calls him Granville Greenwood. This source, which contains a short biography on him by his daughter, calls him George. A bit confusing to say the least. I left a message at Wikiproject Shakespeare (as he was a well-known Shakespearean scholar) about two months ago but no-one bothered to reply. How reliable do you think this Hansard website is anyway, I've found a number of errors in it. Tryde (talk) 09:34, 15 May 2009 (UTC)
Do you have any opinions on Category:Hackney Members of Parliament? It's not in the same format as the other MP categories, and seems to represent multiple constituencies (although that may just be due to repeated renamings and redrawings). Ought it to be renamed? – iridescent 13:18, 19 May 2009 (UTC)
I see you rated this stub & mid-Importance back in March. I've expanded the article to cover the report published today. Would you care to give the new version a piercing glance to see how it reads now? I'm happy to polish it: today's edits were "breaking news" and there will no doubt be more to come. - Pointillist (talk) 18:24, 20 May 2009 (UTC)
Please see Talk:List of United Kingdom MPs#Rename to United Kingdom? --PBS (talk) 10:25, 24 May 2009 (UTC)
The Barnstar of Diligence | ||
Just noticed that you reverted some vandalism on my user page last month, and wanted to say thanks. Seivad (talk) 16:20, 27 May 2009 (UTC) |
Please can you stop changing the name in the post for the GAA player John Joe O'Reilly to JJ. His name is John Joe & should remain that way. Shame on you for changing, please leave it alone and stick to your FG guy, (who I have never heard of BTW) THANKS John Joe O'Reilly (grandson) johnjoeoreilly@gmail.com
Johnjoeoreilly (talk) 06:12, 29 May 2009 (UTC)
WTF is Johnjoeoreilly (talk) 06:12, 29 May 2009 (UTC) ?
- I don't know what you are talking about. So far as I can see, I have not "changed the name" of either John Joe O'Reilly or J. J. O'Reilly. --BrownHairedGirl (talk) • (contribs) 20:25, 7 June 2009 (UTC)
Hi BHG. I wonder if you could look at a disagreement between myself and Special:Contributions/92.16.9.31 I want to remove reference to a caution which I believe unbalances an article on one of our better backbenchers. I accept it was newsworthy a year ago and I don't want to discourage anyone but a year later, I think the time has come to remove it. Could you give an opinion, preferably on the his talk page where I have already left a note? Many thanks in advance JRPG (talk) 21:36, 31 May 2009 (UTC)
Hi BrownHairedGirl,
Can you please lift the semi-protect that you put on Ireland. I complained about it as an IP, another user has complained about it now (here).
It is a very highly visited pages and three months seems like an excessive ammount of time to block the vast majority of our readers from editing such a popular page on the encyclopedia that supposedly "anyone can edit". --rannṗáirtí anaiṫnid (coṁrá) 00:53, 3 June 2009 (UTC)
- The semi-protection was added because of a problem with vandalism. If you think it's not justified, you may want to make a request at WP:RFPP. --BrownHairedGirl (talk) • (contribs) 20:28, 7 June 2009 (UTC)
You should know of the new arb thread, Wikipedia:Arbitration/Requests/Amendment#Request_to_amend_prior_case:_Ireland_article_names. Cheers, —Preceding unsigned comment added by Deacon of Pndapetzim (talk • contribs) 23:26, 4 June 2009
- Thanks for the pointer. It's all very tedious: there is clearly no possibility of a consensus, and this will only be resolved by a community-wide poll, and until that is done this one will run and run. --BrownHairedGirl (talk) • (contribs) 20:41, 7 June 2009 (UTC)
I've finally gotten around to responding to your message on my talk page. --Cyde Weys 02:37, 8 June 2009 (UTC)
So many users in that page keep on putting false claims about Regine Velasquez' achievements and talent, to the point that they make up fake 'achievements' about her so-called 'reign'. Velasquez is not famous all over the world, she has not sold one million records all over Asia. They keep sensationalizing her page by writing over hyped and false claims such as having a 'palatial house', albums selling over 10X platinum, that Regine rejected the Miss Saigon role, and so much more. Thank you. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 124.104.22.195 (talk) 22:52, 12 June 2009 (UTC)
The Established editors association will be a kind of union of who have made substantial and enduring contributions to the encyclopedia for a period of time (say, two years or more). The proposed articles of association are here - suggestions welcome.
If you wish to be elected, please notify me here. If you know of someone else who may be eligible, please nominate them here
Discussion is here.Peter Damian (talk) 20:01, 15 June 2009 (UTC)
Back in February, I engaged in a discussion with some of the editors who are involved with succession boxes and headers. I started the conversation because I came across what I regard as a pretty significant error in the usage of one of the headers, namely, the {{s-ppo}} header. The guideline for its usage is actually pretty close to what it should be:
- These are offices that are part of the mechanisms of political parties. They include:
- Party leaders/chairmen
- Whips
- Party candidates for the Presidency of the United States, France, etc.
- Chairpersons of the Democratic and Republican National Committees (United States)
- Only important positions in major parties should be given succession boxes.
Unfortunately, this is not how it is being used. Probably because of the fact that the American presidential nominees are getting this header (which is in of itself, of debatable accuracy), other party nominees are being given this header as well. Failed candidates for state governorships, and in at least one case that I've seen, a failed candidate for one of the 435 seats in the US House of Representatives. These people, simply put, do not hold any political office, in the sense that anyone familiar with American politics would support. If you would like to discuss this further, I'd be happy to, but it appears to me that the matter is more or less settled, and the other editors are okay with doing what I would like to do, namely, create a new header, namely, {{s-ppn}} , for political party nominees.
I recognize that creating a new template, and even more, creating a new header, is not something to be done lightly. But this is necessary. The alternative (with which I would also be okay) would simply be to remove the header altogether.
Anyway, I am coming to you because, a) you seem to be something of an expert in this area, and b) I am a technophobe, or, more accurately (and less elegantly) a technomoron. I finally today got around to trying to create this header that I said over two months ago that I would make, and I spent nearly two hours trying to figure out how to do it, and could not. I have looked everywhere I can think of, and even wikipages that seemed to promise to show me what to do apparently also presume a level of knowledge I don't have. I'm hoping that you can either show me how to do it, or perhaps do it yourself. My preference is the former, simply because I am biased towards increasing my own knowledge. But I can also understand that you may have neither the time nor the inclination to lead me through the experience.
Oh, one more thing. I am only thinking now about political nominees in the United States. I am well aware that, for example, in Britain, there exist shadow offices for the entire life of a Parliament. It's an entirely different thing, and I have no intention of trying to change things over there.
A poll is up at Wikipedia:WikiProject_Ireland_Collaboration/Poll on Ireland (xxx). This is a vote on what option or options could be added in the poll regarding the naming of the Ireland and Republic of Ireland and possibly the Ireland (disambiguation) pages. The order that the choices appear in the list has been generated randomly. Sanctions for canvassing, forum shopping, ballot stuffing, sock puppetry, meat puppetry will consist of a one-month ban, which will preclude the sanctioned from participating in the main poll which will take place after this one. Voting will end at 21:00 (UTC) of the evening of 1 July 2009 (that is 22:00 IST and BST). -- BigDuncTalk 20:57, 24 June 2009 (UTC)
A poll is up at Wikipedia:WikiProject_Ireland_Collaboration/Poll on Ireland (xxx). This is a vote on what option or options could be added in the poll regarding the naming of the Ireland and Republic of Ireland and possibly the Ireland (disambiguation) pages. The order that the choices appear in the list has been generated randomly. Sanctions for canvassing, forum shopping, ballot stuffing, sock puppetry, meat puppetry will consist of a one-month ban, which will preclude the sanctioned from participating in the main poll which will take place after this one. Voting will end at 21:00 (UTC) of the evening of 1 July 2009 (that is 22:00 IST and BST). -- Evertype·✆ 18:15, 24 June 2009 (UTC)
This may, or may not, be up your street. Uncle G (talk) 08:28, 19 July 2009 (UTC)
A poll has been set up at Wikipedia:WikiProject_Ireland_Collaboration/Poll on Ireland article names. This is a formal vote regarding the naming of the Ireland and Republic of Ireland and possibly the Ireland (disambiguation) pages. The result of this poll will be binding on the affected article names for a period of two years. This poll arose from the Ireland article names case at the Arbitration Committee and the Ireland Collaboration Project. The order that the choices appear in the list has been generated randomly. Voting will end at 21:00 (UTC) of the evening of 13 September 2009 (that is 22:00 IST and BST). |
Howdy,
John Liver Eating Johnston, John Johnson, Liver Eating Johns(t)on and John Garrison are all the same individual.
I noted that the discussion page is filled with questions and statements about him. The Wiki main description of him, I have tried to add some items and when I put them in someone edits it out.
I would safely say I have the complete bio on Johnston. He was not born in 1824, he was not named John, he was not bigger than 6 foot and he did not do half the deeds the Crow Killer book and the mountain men sites state. He did a lot. He did kill men. He did change his name. and so on......
I do have his complete gene workup.
I have a site www.johnlivereatingjohnston which is mostly generic, but I am saving the hard fought facts for the book.
Thanks,
Dorman Nelson Biographer Granada Hills, California 91394 www.johnliveratingjohnston.com —Preceding unsigned comment added by 69.108.94.161 (talk) 01:33, 6 August 2009 (UTC)
User:BrownHairedGirl/Archive has been identified as an Awesome Wikipedian, Peace, A record of your Day will always be kept here. |
For a userbox you can add to your userbox page, see User:Rlevse/Today/Happy Me Day! and my own userpage for a sample of how to use it. — Rlevse • Talk • 01:28, 24 August 2009 (UTC)
I am hoping that you could cast your eye over the current controversy about categorising the Sea Shepherd Conservation Soceity as eco-terrorists. The debate started when an anonymous IP put the category eco-terrorism on the article page, no less than eleven times. I and other editors argue that the category labels people and groups in the same way the former categories 'terrorist' ad 'war criminals' did, as well as the category pseudoscience did for psychoanalysis, which resulted in an Arbcom decision against such labelling AFAIK. The eco-terrorism category debate is presently on the NPOV page here and began at article #66 Eco terrorism category on the Sea Shepherd Conservation Society talk page here.
The relevant decisions were presented by Hans Adler as: CfD for 'terrorists'; Cfd for 'war criminals'; and WP:PSCI as well as WP:PSEUDOSCIENCE#Obvious pseudoscience for the psychoanalyis decision.
The Wikipedia article eco-terrorism is not NPOV and is factually deficient, it is not a good source for information, so please seek background information elsewhere.
Should the Sea Shepherd article still continue to carry the 'eco-terrorism' category while this issue is debated? Should the eco-terrorism article be flagged for readers with the NPOV and FACTUAL warnings? Is the category 'eco-terrorism' a candidate for CfD?
Yours, TranquillityBase Message 07:18, 14 September 2009 (UTC)
- 17:41, 16 March 2008 BrownHairedGirl protected Dominican College, Fortwilliam (persistent vandalism from anon IPs [edit=autoconfirmed:move=autoconfirmed])
That was 18 months ago. I'd like to review this to see if semiprotection is still necessary. See talk:Dominican College, Fortwilliam. --TS 12:23, 15 September 2009 (UTC)
- Now unprotected, but see my comment at talk:Dominican College, Fortwilliam. --BrownHairedGirl (talk) • (contribs) 12:29, 15 September 2009 (UTC)
BrownHairedGirl,
Your Request for Adminship (RfA) process was reviewed and studied by our research team at Carnegie Mellon University early in our project to gain insights into the process. We reviewed what voters discussed about your case, and what qualifications you brought to the table as a candidate. In total 50 cases were personally read and reviewed, and we based our further research questions in part on your case. Congraluations on being granted the Admin mop, and we are confident the group made the right decision in your case!
In continuing our research, I would like to personally invite you to participate in a survey we are conducting to get perspective from people who have participate in the RfA process. The survey will only take a few minutes of your time, and will aid furthering our understanding of online communities, and may assist in the development of tools to assist voters in making RfA evaluations. We are NOT attempting to spam anyone with this survey and are doing our best to be considerate and not instrusive in the Wikipedia community. The results of this survey are for academic research and are not used for any profit nor sold to any companies. We will also post our results back to the Wikipedia community.
This survey is part of an ongoing research project by students and faculty at the Carnegie Mellon University School of Computer Science and headed by Professor Robert Kraut.
Thank you!
If you have any questions or concerns, feel free comment on my talk page.
CMUResearcher (talk) 15:49, 16 September 2009 (UTC)
Back in February, I engaged in a discussion with some of the editors who are involved with succession boxes and headers. I started the conversation because I came across what I regard as a pretty significant error in the usage of one of the headers, namely, the {{s-ppo}} header. The guideline for its usage is actually pretty close to what it should be:
- These are offices that are part of the mechanisms of political parties. They include:
- Party leaders/chairmen
- Whips
- Party candidates for the Presidency of the United States, France, etc.
- Chairpersons of the Democratic and Republican National Committees (United States)
- Only important positions in major parties should be given succession boxes.
Unfortunately, this is not how it is being used. Probably because of the fact that the American presidential nominees are getting this header (which is in of itself, of debatable accuracy), other party nominees are being given this header as well. Failed candidates for state governorships, and in at least one case that I've seen, a failed candidate for one of the 435 seats in the US House of Representatives. These people, simply put, do not hold any political office, in the sense that anyone familiar with American politics would support. If you would like to discuss this further, I'd be happy to, but it appears to me that the matter is more or less settled, and the other editors are okay with doing what I would like to do, namely, create a new header, namely, {{s-ppn}} , for political party nominees.
I recognize that creating a new template, and even more, creating a new header, is not something to be done lightly. But this is necessary. The alternative (with which I would also be okay) would simply be to remove the header altogether.
Anyway, I am coming to you because, a) you seem to be something of an expert in this area, and b) I am a technophobe, or, more accurately (and less elegantly) a technomoron. I finally today got around to trying to create this header that I said over two months ago that I would make, and I spent nearly two hours trying to figure out how to do it, and could not. I have looked everywhere I can think of, and even wikipages that seemed to promise to show me what to do apparently also presume a level of knowledge I don't have. I'm hoping that you can either show me how to do it, or perhaps do it yourself. My preference is the former, simply because I am biased towards increasing my own knowledge. But I can also understand that you may have neither the time nor the inclination to lead me through the experience.
Oh, one more thing. I am only thinking now about political nominees in the United States. I am well aware that, for example, in Britain, there exist shadow offices for the entire life of a Parliament. It's an entirely different thing, and I have no intention of trying to change things over there.
So, can you help me? Unschool 02:13, 17 September 2009 (UTC)
- Hi Unschool, and thanks for your message. I'm not spending much time on wikipedia at the moment, but I'll try to help if I can.
- However, I'm not entirely clear about what the technical problem is. Can you explain to me what exactly you're trying to do, and where you are getting stuck?
- What I think you mean is that you want a new template {{s-ppn}}, but I'm not sure exactly what you want it to do. --BrownHairedGirl (talk) • (contribs) 13:36, 18 September 2009 (UTC)
Hiya BHG. IMHO, Arbcom should've chosen the articles-in-question names. But had they, it might've set a precedent that might've been troublesome for Wikipedia. Guess we'll never know. GoodDay (talk) 16:40, 19 September 2009 (UTC)
You made a mistake. Note that my notice in the block log did not refer to vandalism, but other violations of site policies. Cirt (talk) 20:22, 21 September 2009 (UTC)
- Further, your note in the block log also appears to be incorrect - - nowhere in the block log rationale did it refer to vandalism. Also - you made a comment at my talk page that you had "proposed shortening the block to 48 hours" - not that you would unblock altogether instead. This seems to be a wholly different course of action. Cirt (talk) 20:27, 21 September 2009 (UTC)
Oh dear, sorry Cirt -- slightly crossed wires here. :(
Your block didn't allege vandalism, and I'm sorry if what I wrote implied that. The vandalism label was applied by the complainant Hell in a Bucket (talk · contribs), not by you, but your generalised ref to "policies" allowed Mick to think that vandalism was part of the block rationale. I know that wasn't what you intended, but I hope you can see in hindsight how it was readable that way and that this opened up the potential for confusion.
On the timing, sorry -- I screwed up. Had it in my head when I lifted the block that it had already run for 48 hours, rather than the ~28 hours it had actually run for. My fault, I should have checked. However, the autoblock was still in place (I have just lifted it), so the total time blocked was about 40 hours. I hope that's close enough. --BrownHairedGirl (talk) • (contribs) 06:05, 22 September 2009 (UTC)
- I would appreciate it if you could note somewhere, perhaps in the block log for MickMacNee, that my prior block of him was appropriate, and was not a block for "vandalism". Your block log note makes it seem like my admin action was inappropriate, when in actuality it was certainly necessitated. Cirt (talk) 10:58, 22 September 2009 (UTC)
- I'd be delighted to clarify things that way, but I'm sure how to do it. The best I can think of is to apply a 1-minute block on Mick, but do you know of any better way? --BrownHairedGirl (talk) • (contribs) 11:43, 22 September 2009 (UTC)