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Nightlife in Bangkok doesnt feel like a Wikipedia article

(This is my first time here at the Helpdesk, hope i do this right) The article starts with the sentence "The nightlife in Bangkok, the capital city of Thailand, has traditionally had a reputation for rowdiness, but in 2011 it was reported that the city's crime rate had decreased." That is just a piece of trivia and not the first sentence to a Wikipedia article. Similar things happen throughout the whole article, noting stuff like the price of Local vs Import Beer. How can i alert people to this, as leaving a note on the Talk page probably wont be noticed? — Preceding unsigned comment added by Schmalzbrot (talk • contribs) 00:48, 12 July 2025 (UTC)

You could:

1. Do the research and fix it yourself.

2. There could possibly be a project/group that specializes in this topic that could fix it. 24.190.200.120 (talk) 02:19, 12 July 2025 (UTC)

Looks to me like it needs a rewrite from scratch. Someone has WP:ProD'd it which makes sense to me in a way, but the topic may be notable. You could always create a draft with good sources, while you're waiting for the ProD. -- D'n'B-📞 -- 07:23, 13 July 2025 (UTC)

Egyptian Hieroglyphs for Dummies

A scan of the original

(A specific dummy: myself.) I want to cite a paper that is headed as shown. The citation will be simple and straightforward, aside from the hieroglyphs -- for me, an unfamiliar writing system.

The paper doesn't identify the glyphs: Gardiner assumes that his readers will be familiar with the glyphs that compose the word he discusses. As I look within his own sign list, I identify/misidentify the five as:

[Why the line break after the hieroglyphs?] (E9 Z7 G1 N35 A2 -- PNG files, via the "hiero" tag)

Likewise, as I look through List of Egyptian hieroglyphs, I identify/misidentify the five as:

𓃛𓏲𓄿𓈖𓀁 (again, E9 Z7 G1 N35 A2 -- but this time Unicode characters)

Those of you who are more accustomed to hieroglyphs (or are just wider awake) than I am can perhaps point out my misidentifications.

Even if I've got the hieroglyphs right, their arrangement is wrong. A second try with Gardiner's signs:

("Z7:E9-N35:G1-A2") Not quite right (even aside from the unwanted line break, the "coil-of-rope" glyph should be top right of the sleeping beast, not top centre); but an improvement.

I'd like a second try with Unicode characters, but I'm stuck. "Egyptian Hieroglyph Format Controls" (from Unicode.org, and not as cryptic as our own "Egyptian Hieroglyph Format Controls") provides "13434 EGYPTIAN HIEROGLYPH INSERT AT TOP END" ("top end" seemingly meaning "top right"), and "1343A EGYPTIAN HIEROGLYPH INSERT AT TOP". However, I don't understand how one might use these ... entities. And there may be a more fundamental problem. I fear that even if I did manage the successful use of these or similarly recherché resources of Unicode, they'd baffle later editors, who'd well-intentionedly delete them or screw them up.

Fixes, suggestions? -- Hoary (talk) 01:18, 8 July 2025 (UTC)

@Hoary: it seems to be cited here as

GARDINER, A. H. (1904): The word iwn3. In: Zeitschrift für Ägyptische. Sprache und Altertumskunde 41: 130–135.

Hopefully an expert will turn up, otherwise there is always WP:RDL. TSventon (talk) 03:31, 8 July 2025 (UTC)

Ah but TSventon, I've seen it cited with its title rendered complete with hieroglyphs, in both a book chapter and a journal article (neither of which was itself concerned with hieroglyphs). If the printing company for each could do it (even if only semi-legibly for one, and missing a glyph for the other), I imagined that Mediawiki could as well, and do it better. Let's try:

Gardiner, Alan H. (1904). "The word " (PDF). Zeitschrift für Ägyptische Sprache und Altertumskunde. 41: 130–135 – via Internet Archive. {{cite journal}}: hiero stripmarker in |title= at position 45 (help)

Well, a minor bonus: the unwanted line break is no more. "Stripmarker" is a new word for me. (BTW, I haven't mentioned the matter at WP:RDL but I have pinged Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Writing systems.) -- Hoary (talk) 04:14, 8 July 2025 (UTC)

The <hiero>...</hiero> tag causes MediaWiki to create a series of hieroglyph images in an html table. As part of that creation, MediaWiki also creates a matching stripmarker for use as a placeholder. These placeholders (stripmarkers) are replaced with the html table of hieroglyph images just before final rendering of the page (after templates and modules have been expanded). cs1|2 emits the error message because it cannot see the content of the hiero stripmarker so the metadata that cs1|2 creates for users of reference management software (Zotero and the like), will be corrupt or incomplete.

Best practice for citing works that have a title with hieroglyphs is to manually cite without using a cs1|2 template.

—Trappist the monk (talk) 14:18, 8 July 2025 (UTC)

Thank you for your learned advice, Trappist the monk. I've adjusted the reference accordingly [in the article, not above]. (I took the opportunity to link not the six-page article but instead the 150+ page volume; because even if six pages are all that are wanted, 150+ are what the inquisitive will get.) It's a lot less ugly now. Still, it has me admiring the skills of the compositors/typographers of Zeitschrift für Ägyptische Sprache und Altertumskunde [de] -- though of course they had only a few kinds of script to accommodate, not dozens. -- Hoary (talk) 22:28, 8 July 2025 (UTC) [Added clarification Hoary (talk) 22:41, 8 July 2025 (UTC)]

My first rearrangement of the Unicode characters was not a success:

𓏲

𓃛

𓈖

𓄿

𓀁

Perhaps I could experiment with negative margins; but doing so would risk a real mess with some alternative font. -- Hoary (talk) 05:19, 8 July 2025 (UTC)

I'm not sure if this is what you want, but I recreated the text in the provided image using CSS.

Extended content
The word E9 Z7 G1 N35 A2𓃛𓏲𓄿𓀁𓈖. And smaller: The word E9 Z7 G1 N35 A2𓃛𓏲𓄿𓀁𓈖.

The code: The word <span style="font-size: 0px;">E9 Z7 G1 N35 A2</span><span style="display: inline-block; max-width: 2.5em; user-select: none;" aria-hidden="true"><span style="position: relative; top: -0.2em;">𓃛<span style="position: relative; top: -0.2em; left: -0.1em; font-size: 0.8em;">𓏲</span></span>𓄿𓀁<span style="position: relative; top: -0.9em; left: -1.4em;">𓈖</span></span>. OutsideNormality (talk) 04:34, 9 July 2025 (UTC)

Thank you, OutsideNormality (and apologies for noticing your comment so belatedly). Unfortunately this doesn't work for me -- I mean, it doesn't work as desired even as I view it here (via Firefox under a Debian derivative). This is of course disappointing but it's not surprising; I've found that the exact same chunk of Mediawiki (with the same SPAN tags and the same CSS around the same five Unicode hieroglyphs) is rendered in quite different ways depending on its position in the paragraph. I think we're stuck with the alternative approach, using the HIERO tags. Still, thank you for your code, which reminds me of some CSS attributes I'd forgotten about during five years or so of lack of practice. -- Hoary (talk) 00:10, 13 July 2025 (UTC)

Citations on mobile

Am I correct that the citation tools that the source editor has on desktop are not available on mobile? How are people adding citations on mobile without manually typing the full templates? Thanks! Helpful Cat -talk- 02:23, 9 July 2025 (UTC)

Not quite correct, Helpful Cat. See Wikipedia:Enable_mobile_version for instructions on switching your mobile to desktop mode. Maproom (talk) 08:17, 9 July 2025 (UTC)

Thanks! Yeah, what I meant is that the citation tools aren't available in the mobile version. But switching to desktop mode on mobile is a good idea. Helpful Cat -talk- 11:57, 9 July 2025 (UTC)

For anyone else who sees this: I realised that citation tools are available in the mobile visual editor, so another option is to add citations via the visual editor, then switch back to the source editor to add a ref name. (Unfortunately the Wikipedia:Citation expander gadget doesn't seem to appear on mobile either, even though it can be activated in mobile preferences) Helpful Cat {talk} 20:38, 11 July 2025 (UTC)

Fixing cites after text move?

I moved a lot of text to Health effects of electronic cigarettes from Electronic cigarette. Is there an easy way to repair the cites as it would be a lot of effort for me to do it manually? Chidgk1 (talk) 11:51, 9 July 2025 (UTC)

That's a very good question actually and there is a nice trick for it. Why don't you use source editors and copy not just fact but refs too that are written in front of the piece. Like this

Napoleon was born in Corsica in 1769.<ref>Some Source</ref> [[User:Sys64wiki|Sys64]] (talk) 12:57, 9 July 2025 (UTC)

I do use the source editor when merging Chidgk1 (talk) 15:20, 11 July 2025 (UTC)

My page was moved from mainspace to draft

My English page "Supriyo Bandyopadhyay" was moved from mainspace to draft by someone named HRShami. I have no idea why (I do not know HRShami) and I would like it moved back to mainspace so that a Google search can discover it. Please help.

Supriyo Bandyopadhyay Sbandyopa (talk) 01:30, 11 July 2025 (UTC)

Hello, I have checked the article in question and there are no contributions from you whatsoever, so it is not your English page, unless you are the person on the article itself. The article is moved to the the draft by the author of the article because of "paid article". If you want more clarifications you should talk to HRShami directly. Have a good day! ✠ SunDawn ✠ Contact me! 01:35, 11 July 2025 (UTC)

Looks like HRShami is draftifying all the articles they’ve been paid to create. You can submit it for review to become published by placing {{subst:submit}} (Template:AfC submission/submit) at the top of the page. GoldRomean (talk) 01:50, 11 July 2025 (UTC)

I'm assuming they moved them to draftspace since they were operating as a UPE the time they created the articles, and they now want to send them through AfC as they should have. Their block log corraborates this. 🧙‍♀️ Children Will Listen (🐄 talk, 🫘 contribs) 01:58, 11 July 2025 (UTC)

The problem with that is that the editor in question Sbandyopa have to declare his COI first before resubmitting the article for review himself, seeing that it is very likely that he is the person in question. ✠ SunDawn ✠ Contact me! 01:58, 11 July 2025 (UTC)

Also, this is exactly why you don't hire PR agencies to create your article. You should have just waited until someone created it independently, or have followed the COI editing guidelines every step of the creation process to create it yourself. 🧙‍♀️ Children Will Listen (🐄 talk, 🫘 contribs) 02:04, 11 July 2025 (UTC)

Even aside from the matter of payment, this draft is problematic. An article about a person must be based on sources that are independent of that person. -- Hoary (talk) 02:13, 11 July 2025 (UTC)

Yes, I created this article as part of my undisclosed paid editing. I have moved it to the draftspace so that I can improve it before submitting it again to AFC as I should have done in the first place. HRShami (talk) 05:09, 11 July 2025 (UTC)

Please email me if you wish to improve this page in any way. Sbandyopa (talk) 11:52, 11 July 2025 (UTC)

@Sbandyopa Just a note, practically all unsolicited emails you might receive about the draft are from scammers who make false promises and take your money for nothing, see WP:SCAM. Helpful Raccoon (talk) 04:24, 12 July 2025 (UTC)

It seems that HRShami (going by the name Saaed Akhtar when he contacted me), who was paid to create this page, moved it to draft on May 9, 2025 and later a user named Liz deleted it 8 minutes later on the same day. Who should I contact about this and how? Sbandyopa (talk) 13:44, 12 July 2025 (UTC)

Nobody. You don't seem to understand that Wikipedia is an encyclopedia, not a place to advertise yourself or boost your SEO ranking. If you find another paid editor, chances are it'll get deleted again, and the chances are much higher since we know you hired a paid editor to create your article previously. 🧙‍♀️ Children Will Listen (🐄 talk, 🫘 contribs) 15:21, 12 July 2025 (UTC)

The editor was paid for editing services (like a copy editor) and not for PR services. Nothing in that page is advertisement and everything is verifiably true. I have zero interest in SEO ranking. Sbandyopa (talk) 19:39, 13 July 2025 (UTC)

HRShami is the owner of LustrePR, which is, as the name suggests, a PR company. 🧙‍♀️ Children Will Listen (🐄 talk, 🫘 contribs) 19:49, 13 July 2025 (UTC)

By the way, your page was not actually completely "deleted", it was moved to Draft:Supriyo Bandyopadhyay. GoldRomean (talk) 15:30, 12 July 2025 (UTC)

Thank you. This is noted. Sbandyopa (talk) 11:50, 11 July 2025 (UTC)

Full stop dot template

I created Template:Full stop thinking it would work, but Template:Dot is a middle central dot, so I don't know what to do. In Template:Hatnote group, full stop dots don't appear when needed, such as here, after Template:Main, for example. But there were other templates that needed dots that I noticed. Web-julio (talk) 02:01, 11 July 2025 (UTC)

One problem is that not all hatnotes are actually sentences. The ones that are already do have a period, but the ones that aren't do not have a period. MOS:CAPTION has some guidance about punctuation when combining sentences and sentence-fragments. So either each hatnote needs to detect whether it needs a period based on determining whether it is in a hatnote-group or hatnote-group needs to detect whether each hatnote has a period and add one if not. DMacks (talk) 02:44, 11 July 2025 (UTC)

@Web-julio: That template name is confusing. Many English speakers use "full stop" to mean a "period". {{Full stop}} is currently a redirect to {{·}} and should either be renamed to better reflect its purpose; or simply deleted as {{dot}} and {{middot}} already exist for the same purpose. Bazza 7 (talk) 08:47, 11 July 2025 (UTC)

@Web-julio: I agree. May I delete it as an author request? It could also be converted to actually produce a period but I don't know use cases where you couldn't just write a period without a template. I have posted to Template talk:Hatnote group#Any way to get punctuation? PrimeHunter (talk) 11:01, 11 July 2025 (UTC)

I requested. But I thought there existed, so it could be retargeted. Web-julio (talk) 23:07, 11 July 2025 (UTC)

About Washington International University

I want to made a correction about a page on Wikipedia about an online university. The information is wrong and outdated.

Please let me know how I can provide you the updated info.

Actually Washington International University is one of the pioneer modern academic learning system that started in the United States, which is a common methods by most Universities in the U.S and Europe nowadays.

The programs offered by this university were highly academic assigned with a highly experts/ professors. Students had to finalize their study programs with academic learning material, books, researches and the final Thesis.

There are innumerable high level leaders from around the world who studied in Washington International University and received their degrees.

I would like to contribute a longer article and updated information about the positive side of Washington International University. Please let me know how I can do that and and how you or I can edit old page on Wikipedia about this university.

Here is the page: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Washington_International_University BestCiel (talk) 06:49, 11 July 2025 (UTC)

Just a basic question, are you somehow related to this particular university? If yes then you come into WP:COI conflict criteria, read the page and make appropriate advance. In regard to edit, you can read WP:Editing. Sys64 message this user 09:16, 11 July 2025 (UTC)

These are some basic needs you need to keep in mind while editing page, ONLY when you are in COI:

• you should disclose your COI when involved with affected articles;
• you are strongly discouraged from editing affected articles directly;
• you may propose changes on talk pages (by using the {{edit COI}} template), so that they can be peer-reviewed;
• you should put new articles through the Articles for Creation (AfC) process instead of creating them directly;
• you should not act as a reviewer of affected article(s) at AfC, new pages patrol or elsewhere;
• you should respect other editors by keeping discussions concise.

Sys64 message this user 09:19, 11 July 2025 (UTC)

Hello, @BestCiel.

First, as Sys64 says, if you are connected with the university, you have a Conflict of interest. If you are in any way paid or employed by the university (including as an intern or volunteer), Wikipedia regards you as a paid editor, and you must make a formal declaration (see that link for details).

Once you have made your declaration, you may raise edit requests for changes to the article: make them as specific as possible, don't put multiple changes into the same request, and your requests have a much greater chance of being carried out if you include a citation to a reliable independent source, for any information you are seeking to add.

You say you would like to contribute a longer article about "the positive side" of WIU. Such an intention is fundamentally off-purpose for Wikipedia. A Wikipedia article should not give "the positive side" (or "the negative side") of its subject: it should be a neutral summary of what people wholly unconnected with the subject have chosen to publish about the subject, in reliable publications - and little else. (see WP:42). If many of the appropriate sources are positive, the article will reflect that. If they are predominently negative, the article will reflect that; and if they are mixed, again the article will reflect that.

What the article should not reflect, at all, is what the subject says or wants to say about itself, or what the subject's associates say.

If you choose to write an article about WIU (which seems inappropriate, because there is one already) you would need to effectively forget everything you know or think about the university, and summarise what the independent sources say. ColinFine (talk) 11:51, 11 July 2025 (UTC)

@ColinFine, Actually they have sworn that they were graduate of University and did not find it pleasing enough to tell us here. Now they have made copyright edits which have been both reverted and scrutinized. I have warned him but if he continues to do this, I think a block is needed? See his talk page, [] Sys64 message this user 00:43, 12 July 2025 (UTC)

@Sys64wiki, being a graduate of a university is not necessarily a COI. ColinFine (talk) 10:11, 12 July 2025 (UTC)

Template for women's football under-20 and under-17

Hey all, I want to make a medal table for FIFA U-20 World Cup, FIFA U-17 World Cup, FIFA U-20 Women's World Cup, and FIFA U-17 Women's World Cup, the same way as shown in CONCACAF Gold Cup records and statistics for example. But the countries now have to link to the men under 20, men under 17, women under 20 and women under 17, so the templates used for men, "fb", and "fbw" for women don't work here. What are the correct templates? PeruvianCocaine (talk) 11:42, 11 July 2025 (UTC)

@PeruvianCocaine: See {{fbu}} and {{fbwu}} . PrimeHunter (talk) 12:02, 11 July 2025 (UTC)

@PrimeHunter: Thanks! Hm, I tried them out but it doesn't look like they can be used in tables because they create errors. PeruvianCocaine (talk) 12:08, 11 July 2025 (UTC)

@PeruvianCocaine: I don't see any attempt to use them in your saved edits. If you tried a preview then did you remember the age parameter? If you want more help then save your broken code somewhere so we can see what goes wrong. PrimeHunter (talk) 13:31, 11 July 2025 (UTC)

@PrimeHunter: I tried it and used "Show preview" so you can't see it. But I'll try it again at FIFA U-17 Women's World Cup. Please check it. I tried using "fbwu" as a template but it doesn't work. If you use "fbw" it does work. PeruvianCocaine (talk) 13:49, 11 July 2025 (UTC)

@PeruvianCocaine: I see the problem now. {{fbwu}} has an age parameter but {{Medals table}} doesn't have a way to pass it on for |flag_template = fbwu. I made a wrapper template {{fbwu17}} which doesn't itself have an age parameter and that works. But a bunch of wrapper templates for gender-age combinations doesn't seem like a good solution. I will ask if {{Medals table}} can get en extra parameter. PrimeHunter (talk) 14:28, 11 July 2025 (UTC)

@PrimeHunter: Ok, thank you so much for your help! Much appreciated. I reckon you suggest I'll wait with creating the tables? PeruvianCocaine (talk) 14:31, 11 July 2025 (UTC)

@PeruvianCocaine: Yes, I suggest waiting to see if there are replies a Template talk:Medals table#flag_template with age parameter. {{fbwu17}} works for now so you don't have to remove the already made table. PrimeHunter (talk) 14:44, 11 July 2025 (UTC)

@PrimeHunter: Ok, thanks. PeruvianCocaine (talk) 14:46, 11 July 2025 (UTC)

sid vicious article

how can this be amended? It states " Kingsway College of Further Education (later known as Westminster Kingsway College), which was a community and vocational school for students with difficulties" which is not true. FE colleges are simply post school educational facilities which include vocational education. They usually include some special needs provision but this is usually small by comparison to the size of the institution. the govt website states "Further education (FE) includes any study after secondary education that’s not part of higher education (that is, not taken as part of an undergraduate or graduate degree). Courses range from basic English and maths to Higher National Diplomas (HNDs)" 62.30.13.19 (talk) 14:29, 11 July 2025 (UTC)

Hi, have you tried bringing this up on the article's talk page? Perception312 (talk) 14:45, 11 July 2025 (UTC)

I've removed the wording "which was a community and vocational school for students with difficulties". DuncanHill (talk) 15:30, 11 July 2025 (UTC)

DuncanHill, thank you. The removed text was a poor summary of the Guardian source, so it made sense to remove it. TSventon (talk) 15:49, 11 July 2025 (UTC)

A save in wrong format

I publish a area code for town in el Dorado Co California somehow it now the edit preview. Kys.... DMc75771 (talk) 15:53, 11 July 2025 (UTC)

kybu DMc75771 (talk) 16:42, 11 July 2025 (UTC)

DMc75771, your edit has been reverted. You were trying to add Area code 856 which is an area code in New Jersey to Kyburz, California. Please explain why. Cullen328 (talk) 17:06, 11 July 2025 (UTC)

Default headers for association football tournament pages

Hi all, I've noticed that all the hundreds, if not thousands of tournament pages seen on List of association football competitions use different names for headers. It's mainly about 3 ones. For example, what do you call this table:

Rank	Team	Part	Pld	W	D	L	GF	GA	GD	Pts
1	India1	14	62	39	15	8	108	38	+70	132
2	Maldives	12	50	25	11	14	98	52	+46	86
3	Bangladesh	13	46	18	12	16	52	47	+5	66

It's called "Overall team records" on most pages but I've seen people use "Summary" or "All-time table" too. It's a points system so maybe something like "All-time points records" or something would be better?

Nation	Champions	Runners-up	Third-place	Fourth-place	Semi-finalists
India	9 (1993, 1997, 1999, 2005, 2009,[a] 2011, 2015, 2021, 2023)	4 (1995, 2008, 2013, 2018)	1 (2003)	–	–
Maldives	2 (2008, 2018)	3 (1997, 2003, 2009)	2 (1999, 2021)	–	4 (2005, 2011, 2013, 2015)
Bangladesh	1 (2003)	2 (1999, 2005)	1 (1995)	1 (2021)	3 (1995, 2009, 2023)
Afghanistan*	1 (2013)	2 (2011, 2015)	–	–	–
Sri Lanka	1 (1995)	1 (1993)	–	1 (1997)	3 (2008, 2009, 2015)
Nepal	–	1 (2021)	1 (1993)	2 (1995, 1999)	3 (2011, 2013, 2018)
Kuwait3	–	1 (2023)	–

^This one is usually called "Teams reaching the top four" but what's the default name? And lastly:

Team	1993	1995	1997	1999	2003	2005	2008	2009	2011	2013	2015	2018	2021	2023	2025	Total
Bangladesh	×	SF	GS	2nd	1st	2nd	GS	SF	GS	GS	GS	GS	GS	SF	Q	13
Bhutan	Not part of SAFF				GS	GS	SF	GS	GS	GS	GS	GS	×	GS	Q	9
India2	1st	2nd	1st	1st	3rd	1st	2nd	1st	1st	2nd	1st	2nd	1st	1st	Q	14
Maldives	×	×	2nd	3rd	2nd	SF	1st	2nd	SF	SF	SF	1st	GS	GS	Q	12
Nepal	3rd	SF	GS	4th	GS	GS	GS	GS	SF	SF	GS	SF	2nd	GS	Q	14
Pakistan	4th	GS	3rd	GS	4th	SF	GS	GS	GS	GS	×	SF	DQ	GS	Q	12
Sri Lanka	2nd	1st	4th	GS	GS	GS	SF	SF	GS	GS	SF	GS	GS	DQ	Q	13
Former team(s)
Afghanistan3	Not part of SAFF				GS	GS	GS	GS	2nd	1st	2nd	Part of CAFA				7
Guest teams
Kuwait4	×													2nd	×	1
Lebanon4	×													SF	×	1

^This one is usually called "Comprehensive team results by tournament", is it the correct name?

For examples, please see National team appearances in the FIFA World Cup, Africa Cup of Nations and SAFF Championship.

Consensus about these should be reached to avoid future conflicts, because one person might use this and another one uses that and in my opinion it doesn't look very professional if it's all different but mostly, it's easier for everyone if we just stick with defaults. Now pages are constantly being changed because there's no consensus and everyone changes it to what he likes. Can there please be reached default settings for this? PeruvianCocaine (talk) 16:02, 11 July 2025 (UTC) PeruvianCocaine (talk) 16:02, 11 July 2025 (UTC)

Hello @PeruvianCocaine. That sort of consensus is reached by being discussed at an appropriate place, where interested editors are likely to see it. I suggest WT:WikiProject Football ColinFine (talk) 19:54, 11 July 2025 (UTC)

Notes

1. India was represented by the India U-23 team.

application process

Can I get help with login pin number for application process Matswenyego (talk) 17:46, 11 July 2025 (UTC)

It's not clear what you're asking - what application process are you having trouble with? CoconutOctopus talk 17:47, 11 July 2025 (UTC)

how to delete account

how to delete account 24bozz (talk) 18:41, 11 July 2025 (UTC)

It's not possible to delete an account, as legally all edits must be attributable to someone. You may stop using and abandon your account. If you intend to never return, an account in good standing may be vanished. 331dot (talk) 19:05, 11 July 2025 (UTC)

Question about reverting

I am trying to improve the WP:Contents page and then all of a sudden, I get reverted. I understand that this is an important tool on Wikipedia since it helps with undoing vandalism and undo any mistakes that I make while editing. I don't understand why someone would use the revert tool to undo a good faith improvement to Wikipedia when they can just build on the work that I already did on the page. I'm all for reverting good faith edits where the chances of it being built upon by subsequent edits is not looking good, but I'm hoping that I can get a good explanation of why editors are so quick in reverting. Interstellarity (talk) 00:59, 12 July 2025 (UTC)

I have brought you to WP:ANI, because before every major edit, which you are doing in WP: Contents you need to discuss it. This is a violation and you need to answer this there. Sys64 message this user 01:31, 12 July 2025 (UTC)

This should be discussed on the Contents talk page, not ANI. Sarsenet•he/they•(talk) 01:36, 12 July 2025 (UTC)

yes but he is making blatant edits, which requires some answers to administrators. Sys64 message this user 01:37, 12 July 2025 (UTC)

Being WP:BOLD is not a chronic, intractable behavior problem that needs "and block them if needed" Sophisticatedevening🐞^(talk) 01:51, 12 July 2025 (UTC)

Please move to ANI page for other discussions. please note i said if needed which means only and only if it is required, and that is because I overlooked multiple edits without understanding much more. I think I was not going to deal it personally hence I am quite not comfortable with talk page discussion without an administrator involved, per war. Sys64 message this user 01:57, 12 July 2025 (UTC)

Sys64wiki, a suggestion. En:Wikipedia has many articles that are defective in one or more ways. Work on improving these articles. Give yourself a year-long break from advising people on what to do, and from bringing people to WP:ANI. That's because your advice, however well-meant, too often (A) is hard to understand or (B) is seemingly based on misunderstandings. -- Hoary (talk) 02:35, 12 July 2025 (UTC)

Noted. Sys64 message this user 02:40, 12 July 2025 (UTC)

Also there are some specific editors who have taken a tone of digging deeper and looking at specific comments made by user that are not appropriate. Granted, I am not perfect (and nobody is), I would suggest these users to leave this job to checkusers and bureaucrats, as they understand much better what this means and its use instead of some naive editors who have anonymity towards others. Thank you! Sys64 message this user 02:49, 12 July 2025 (UTC)

@Sys64wiki: Pointing out your inappropriate, BITEy Teahouse and Help Desk comments from yesterday is not "digging deeper" into your edit history to find something against you. I'm unsure why you'd want us to "leave this job to checkusers"; I haven't seen anyone accuse you of socking or something of that sort. — DVRTed (Talk) 03:23, 12 July 2025 (UTC)

FTR, I have no idea why (presumably I, due to my comments at ANI), am being called naive and I have not accused Sys64 of socking either. Sarsenet•he/they•(talk) 04:07, 12 July 2025 (UTC)

The answer to your question is reverting is rude and the guidelines tell us it's hostile, puts off unexperienced editors, shouldn't be done if the edit was in good faith, should only be done if nothing about the good faith edit was useful. But a lot of editors do it because it's quicker, they don't care and feel some ownership over a page, or they're more task than people oriented. You can ping the person on the talk page, but honestly, it's probably easier to move on. For problematic people, you'll just be another in a long line of people they'll argue with. MmeMaigret (talk) 06:14, 13 July 2025 (UTC)

Draft:B4B

Hello, I am not a native speaker and yes I use AI for translation. help me in writing the article. I am a Russian speaker, and this concept of the model has proven itself well in my homeland, and I would like it to develop worldwide, as it contributes to the development of good economic relations and global peace.I can't write the article myself because my English is very bad, I would like help in writing, not necessarily on my behalf, I have sources only in Russian and in the form of books, I can scan it to PDF. There is a link to the English version (but I don't know if this is a reliable source ) https://www.arimetrics.com/en/digital-glossary/b4b . also, here is my brief interpretation in Russian : "B4B (Business-for-Business, «бизнес для бизнеса») — управленческая концепция и модель взаимодействия между компаниями, в основе которой лежит идея создания взаимовыгодных партнёрских отношений как важного элемента устойчивого развития и роста бизнеса. Компании, применяющие принципы B4B, рассматривают долгосрочное сотрудничество с деловыми партнёрами в качестве одного из ключевых факторов повышения собственной конкурентоспособности. Подобное сотрудничество, как правило, включает технологическое и организационное развитие партнёров, обмен ресурсами, финансовую поддержку, совместную реализацию проектов, интеграцию бизнес-процессов, создание стратегических альянсов и другие формы совместной деятельности. Модель опирается на концепцию «win–win», которая применительно к В4В предполагает, что возникающая синергия способствует росту эффективности и развитию бизнеса всех участников партнёрской сети Projowio (talk) 10:31, 12 July 2025 (UTC)

Projowio, Wikipedia already has an article on Business-to-business.   Maproom (talk) 13:21, 12 July 2025 (UTC)

There are a lot of pages on the English language wiki that shouldn't exist - the person isn't notable, there are no sources etc. If you can't find any English language sources, that's a good sign that it shouldn't exist on the English wiki. I get that the English wiki is seen as having more reach, but still. Also if you're English isn't that good, again maybe see that as a sign to stick to the Russian wiki. Too many people want to "create" pages. However, the answer to your "how-to" question is create the draft page off your user page, then ask experienced editors for help with the draft (incl grammar and translating the titles of the sources). MmeMaigret (talk) 06:08, 13 July 2025 (UTC)

Per WP:NONENG, while English language sources are preferred, sources in other languages are admissible and do contribute to notability so long as they meet the other criteria for an independent, reliable secondary source.

That said, nobody here is going to write an article for you. We're all volunteers and we work on what interests us.

We do also have a Russian language wikipedia that needs more contributors, though. You could write the article there, in Russian. If it's a good article and well referenced, and if English wikipedia doesn't have an article on the topic, eventually someone may come along who's interested in translating it into English. -- Avocado (talk) 23:47, 13 July 2025 (UTC)

how do I upload a .wikitext file?

how do I upload a .wikitext file? Bigpooz (talk) 12:21, 12 July 2025 (UTC)

@Bigpooz: It looks like you figured it out at User:Bigpooz/Sample page. There is no file upload for wikitext. You just use a browser to create and edit wikitext pages. See Wikipedia:Articles for creation and Wikipedia:Notability (people) if you want to create an article. PrimeHunter (talk) 13:01, 12 July 2025 (UTC)

Hello, @Bigpooz. Looking at that draft, it appears that it has been written WP:BACKWARDS.

My earnest advice to new editors is to not even think about trying to create an article until you have spent several weeks - at least - learning about how Wikipedia works by making improvements to existing articles. Once you have understood core policies such as verifiability, neutral point of view, reliable, independent sources, and notability, and experienced how we handle disagreements with other editors (the Bold, Revert, Discuss cycle), then you might be ready to read your first article carefully, and try creating a draft. If you don't follow this advice but try to create an article without this preparation, you are likely to have a frustrating and disappointing experience with Wikipedia. ColinFine (talk) 13:07, 12 July 2025 (UTC)

Hi @Bigpooz. I wonder if you used a large-language model chatbot like OpenAI's ChatGPT, Claude, Gemini etc to create this page - and that the chatbot mistakenly told you to upload a .wikitext file? Your page at User:Bigpooz/Sample page looks like it was written by an AI chatbot. qcne (talk) 14:36, 12 July 2025 (UTC)

12 July 2025

We've reached consensus about an edit to Template:Automatic taxobox and some other templates. How can I get someone do it? I know I could just contact a template editor or admin but is this the only way? Jako96 (talk) 15:49, 12 July 2025 (UTC)

I think you are looking for {{edit template-protected}}/{{edit protected}} * Pppery * _{it has begun...} 15:54, 12 July 2025 (UTC)

I somehow completely forgot about these, thank you. Jako96 (talk) 20:17, 12 July 2025 (UTC)

@Jako96: If you cannot edit a protected page then the "View source" tab has a button to submit an edit request. PrimeHunter (talk) 21:40, 13 July 2025 (UTC)

Did you edit Wikipedia before creating this account?

Yesterday, I got a message from an IP user asking if I edited Wikipaedia before using this account. You can see it here: User talk:Rafaelthegreat#Did you edit Wikipedia before creating this account?

In this long message, they listed some things I did that I shOuld not have done. So I want to apologize for doing those things. But that is not why I am here. They said this: "Some people, whether autistic or not, are just unfit to contribute to Wikipedia. Vandals, trolls, and abusive and disruptive editors can be blocked or banned, and being autistic is no excuse for unacceptable behaviour." I got confused. I don't think I ever made any excuses for being Autistic. I only included it in my user page.

If I did, please let me know.

Also, they think I used to have another account but got Blocked so I created a new one. That is not true. If you don't believe me, use the Check user tool (If that is what it is for).

The weird thing about this usEr is they only have 2 edits (The first one was made in 2023 and the second one was made for the question. Although this might've been mixed up by being shared.

This user might have been a robot too, because The message was extremely long.

He also said I used it as a therapy tool for autistic people. When did I do that?

Rafael! (He, him) • talk • guestbook • projects 19:45, 12 July 2025 (UTC)

Wow that message is uhh.. well it sure is long. I don't know what their beef is and I think you can safely ignore it. -- D'n'B-📞 -- 19:53, 12 July 2025 (UTC)

Contrary to what they say, you are free to remove pretty much anything from your talk page except for declined unblock requests. You can safely remove their message if you don't feel the need to read or reply to it. Departure– (talk) 19:56, 12 July 2025 (UTC)

One more thing. The message is an LTA filter hit, contains unsubstantiated accusations that in my mind constitute personal attacks, might reasonably be AI generated, and is from what looks to be a throwaway IP. Maybe someone more acquainted with this sort of thing should look a bit more into the specific message being discussed here. Departure– (talk) 21:26, 12 July 2025 (UTC)

That IP has been to ANI with a similar demeanor a few years ago. I don't think they're using an LLM. 🧙‍♀️ Children Will Listen (🐄 talk, 🫘 contribs) 09:25, 14 July 2025 (UTC)

I don't think that message has been produced by AI. It reads like someone who knows an awful lot about how Wikipedia works. There's also a previous post from that IP address that is similarly lengthy and combative. Personally, I'd consider escalate it to the incident board. MmeMaigret (talk) 05:54, 13 July 2025 (UTC)

Critical Race Theory Bias in Wikipedia.

I find it odd that the section for Anthony Johnson, the first slave owner in the U.S.A. is not mentioned to be black, but rather implied. Further more, it is disturbing that that this site will not allow a picture of him to be posted. So, officially, I am asking the representatives of this company, are you allowing bias opinions to affect the decisions of the factual information published? Ravens Asylum (talk) 18:44, 12 July 2025 (UTC) Update, the site does say "he is recorded as a negro".

The article for Anthony Johnson is pretty clear that he was an African man who had previously been enslaved himself. Wikipedia summarises what reliable sources say about a topic, and doesn't provide its own commentary. There's no image as we don't currently have one of him that is suitable; previously an image of the wrong man was present which has obviously been removed. I urge you to remember to assume good faith when dealing with editors on Wikipedia and not go around accusing people of deliberate racial misinformation or you're likely to end up blocked. CoconutOctopus talk 18:51, 12 July 2025 (UTC)

I see it does say "Recorded as a Negro". I posted a picture for Anthony Johnson and it was removed. Turned out this same picture has been rejected the past. It's him. It's resourced. But for some reason this company doesn't want people to know that the first official slave owner in the U.S. is black. It goes against the narrative that the white man is evil. It's time to stand up to woke ideology and call out the hypocrisies of Wikipedia. Perhaps I missed it, does it say that he was a slave owner as well? Or does it just say that he earned his freedom and became a tobacco farmer? Ravens Asylum (talk) 19:43, 12 July 2025 (UTC)

I would add that this is not a "company", we are all volunteers here, not paid staff. The Wikimedia Foundation has paid staff, but they are not involved in editing decisions, typically. 331dot (talk) 19:51, 12 July 2025 (UTC)

The infobox already says that he fought to own an African slave, John Casor. Please see WP:RIGHTGREATWRONGS. 🧙‍♀️ Children Will Listen (🐄 talk, 🫘 contribs) 19:51, 12 July 2025 (UTC)

I agree with CO that the article makes it clear this man was Black. Is this the picture you uploaded wherever? Doesn't look 1600 to me, but if you have a WP:RS that says so, tell us what it is, then we can probably use it. Gråbergs Gråa Sång (talk) 20:00, 12 July 2025 (UTC)

That is so obviously not an image of Anthony Johnson that I would oppose adding it even if we did have WP:RS that says so. We'd probably end up having to strike that source off the WP:RS list. -- asilvering (talk) 20:06, 12 July 2025 (UTC)

It could be AJ in the sense of (later) "artistic depiction". But again, I'd like to see a history book that says so. Gråbergs Gråa Sång (talk) 20:13, 12 July 2025 (UTC)

See Lewis Hayden, though. Gråbergs Gråa Sång (talk) 20:20, 12 July 2025 (UTC)

Nice catch. -- asilvering (talk) 20:34, 12 July 2025 (UTC)

@Asilvering See description on the File:Portrait of 19th century abolitionist Lewis Hayden, sometimes falsely presented as being 17th century enslaver Anthony Johnson.png page. Gråbergs Gråa Sång (talk) 08:17, 13 July 2025 (UTC)

That blog looks like it promotes fringe and neo-Confederate content. 🧙‍♀️ Children Will Listen (🐄 talk, 🫘 contribs) 20:13, 12 July 2025 (UTC)

Btw, why don't you count for example Edward Bennett (colonist) as an earlier slaveowner in the USA? Not that any of them lived in the USA, of course. Gråbergs Gråa Sång (talk) 20:04, 12 July 2025 (UTC)

For the interested, the article is Anthony Johnson (colonist). Gråbergs Gråa Sång (talk) 19:50, 12 July 2025 (UTC)